Hard to find viens with Aortic Stenosis?

[vhmoriarty]

Has anyone else had problems getting IV's, blood drawn , etc due to having Aortic Stenosis?

Everytime I go in to have anything done with blood, I tell them I have bad veins and am a hard stick. Yeah they have all heard it before yada yada.

Well the other night in the ER they had to stick me three times before finally getting a IV into my hand where I told them to start with to begin with...duh.

When I was hospitiallized in 2007 with my daughter they had the same problem. I was in the hospital 6 weeks before she was born. Labs were required every three days. They had to put a central line into my neck to draw blood from. During my delivery I had a Swan cath in my neck and a central line in my arm, and two ivs in my hands.

Has anyone else had this problem?
Did it go away after your AVR?
What causes it?

 

[Duff Man]

I'm usually very hard to stick (mild stenosis though).

I had a lady recently that was awesome. She told me to "wiggle your toes and count to ten"... she had zero issues getting the vein the first time.

She said that alot of people anticipate the pain and the blood vessels constrict because of the anticipation. Telling the patient to do something takes their mind off the task at hand. I've actually experienced the same phenomenon in the past and someone said the same thing, but I shrugged it off as superstition until recently when it helped me twice and confirmed twice by nurses.

 

[Nancy]

Believe me, when they want to get into your veins, they will find a way. Joe was a hard stick because he had so much bloodwork over the years, his veins were all scarred up. The hospital had a couple of nurses whose job it was to do the very difficult needle sticks and IV PICC lines and they covered the whole hospital and were known as the IV team. They took over when the regular nursing staff couldn't get an IV in or do a blood draw.

They were experts and nailed it every time on the first or second stick. Very professional.

Not to worry. There are veins everywhere that they can use.

I had to have chemo a few years ago and my veins got damaged by it. I've had IVs placed above my elbow, in my wrist and when I had my last couple of chemo sessions high up on my arm, in the back of my arm. One told me about a vein around the back of your arm they called the "Saturday night special". That one was their ace in the hole.

 

[vhmoriarty]

I know they usually have to call in the IV team with me or I request them cause they are so hard to find....But Duff, Im going to try that on Thursday and see if it works, I go for labs then,....Thanks!

 

[catwoman]

My sister has the same problem with veins. But she doesn't have any cardiac problems.
She's just had so many IVs, infusion treatments, etc., in the last 10 years that it's difficult to find a good vein.

 

[vhmoriarty]

My late husband was on comadin...and they always seemed to get him on first stick and everything. He suffered from:

viral cardiomyopathy, TIA, congestive heart failure, syncope, sleep apnea. and was awaiting a heart transplant cause his ejection fraction rate was 11%

Still even in the end they were able to get to his veins.

Myself however, havent really had injections, etc. Its just everytime they do the normal labs (hence I am afraid of needles) they have to end up sticking me like 3 times.

 

[Superbob]

Lab people have a hard time drawing my wife's blood -- because of tiny veins, though, not stenosis. Often they have to use the butterfly method, which entails a special needle.

 

[Lionheart]

I think the more you are stuck the worse the veins get, maybe even to the point of causing collapsed veins. I agree with Bob, ask them to use a small butterfly needle and get a technician that has a lot of experience. Some are better than others.
John

 

[Lily]

...Has anyone else had this problem?
Did it go away after your AVR?
What causes it?

You have my empathy.

I've always had this trouble. My personal record was four IV attempts, by surgical nurses, for a post-valve replacement abdominal surgery. The three missed IVs literally hurt more than the surgery did.

I often end up with the IV in the back of my hand or in the underside of my wrist. Sometimes it has been very painful. I have heard that if an IV hurts, that it is not a good one. I don't know if that is absolutely true but it has been pretty accurate in my experience.

I've been told that my trouble is that I have deep veins. But also I've heard that some people have rolling veins and that makes them difficult also.

One nurse told me to drink a glass of water an hour before any blood draws. That does work when I can do it.

It would be interesting to find out if there was some connection to having these genetic valve issues and these vein issues. But I've never heard of such before.

 

[vhmoriarty]

Most of the time when I can get them to agree, I get them to use a butterfly in my hands. I have two really good veins there.

When they go for my arms however they find a (good one) and it blows or rolls.

I hate the poking and proding for the viens. Getting IVs I always say is worse than anything.

I remember my c-section, Swan Cath in my neck and central line in my arm not hurting as bad as them trying to find a vien for a IV but if I want to be knocked out for all the stuff they will have to prep me for before the Ross Im going to need something.

BTW......what happens once you get into the OR? Such as caths, ivs, etc. How many do you get while you are AWAKE? YEah I might just pass out at the thought of that one, lol.

 

[Lily]

...BTW......what happens once you get into the OR? Such as caths, ivs, etc. How many do you get while you are AWAKE? YEah I might just pass out at the thought of that one, lol.

Before the valve surgery, I was only awake for one regular IV. Of course, it didn't go in the first time . But all the rest of the needles and catheters and such happened after I nodded off.

And since I had also read so here, I remembered to ask for pain meds right before they pulled the drain tubes out post-op.

 

[DebbyA]

Another hard stick...when I had a sudden return to the hospital for effusion, the vein they finally used was in my armpit!
I've been told I have small veins, and the latest is that my veins 'roll'.
A nurse told me one time to have them use a blood-pressure cuff and pump it to 40, but I've found that no one will take advice from a mere patient! I usually tell them "you only get one chance".
When I had my physical a couple of weeks ago, the tech got it in, but I still have a bruise. Also her method apparently caused red blood cell damage, giving me an abnormally high potassium reading. That required another stick to check the potassium in a week, plus another one next week. My doctor is sending me to the hospital blood lab for those, so I won't be on a merry-go-round.

 

[Duffey]

Aortic stenosis has nothing to do with it.

 

[Superman]

Unrelated. I was born with a BAV, stenotic from infancy. I've always been very fortunate with really good veins. I've got a nice big one down my right arm near the surface that is a can't miss for even the worst of techs. Up and down both forearms I have nice blue veins all visible at the surface and a pretty decent size.

Now, after a week of getting stuck over and over in the hospital, the last couple blood draws did require a butterfly - but your arms can only take so much. The bruising is starting to subside and my veins appear to be coming back.

I just wish the finger prick method of INR testing was standard protocol for labs too. I still don't get why they need a tube full of blood for that simple test.

 

[olefin]

Agree, aortic stenosis didn't do it.

I have large veins but after 20 days in the hospital the ones in my arms got to looking kind of sad.

It's always been a problem for my wife. I think it's a woman thing.

 

[tobagotwo]

Totally agree with Duffey, Superman, and Olefin. Aortic stenosis has nothing to do with being a "tough stick."

Except in one, roundabout way: because of it, you may have been hospitalized multiple times and had so many sticks, that it's hard to find a good spot, as Nancy was relating.

I used to be a great stick, and gave blood four times a year at work for over two decades (yes, you can give after OHS, after a waiting period, and assuming you're not on warfarin). But they changed Red Cross agencies, and the people working for the new agency were not very capable. I lost my two best veins from their imcompetence. I didn't know that could happen, as I had given so successfully for so long. Fortunately, most Red Cross groups have excellent employees. I was unfortunate in getting a couple of rare dodos.

BEst wishes,

 

[ALCapshaw2]

AH Yes, the Butterfly in the Hands Solution.... works every time!

I second the recommendation to drink a glass of water at least 1 hour before your lab draws. Low hydration can limit how much the veins will 'puff up' after the tourniquet is applied.

Re: Rolling Veins, I've had only 2 nurses who knew how to stick a Rolling Vein the first time. One (guy) mentioned 'stabilizing' the vein with one hand and aiming for the SIDE of the vein with the needle. Seemed to work.

 

[vhmoriarty]

I had just wondered about the stenosis, cause they talk about it where I dont have enough blood flow going through my body due to it, so wasnt sure.

And they NEVER listen to me either when I tell them where to go first, its like a contest to prove me wrong...and guess what I always WIN, lol and they end up being where they should have started to begin with.

I have two really good viens in my hands, but thats about it.

I just want to be knocked out, doped up, in lala land when they do all the other stuff.....vent, swan cath, central line in my arm, cath in my bladder, ugh!

Thanks guys!

Keep the tips coming on how to be a good stick!

and oh I guess if its a woman thing...then we are pretty good, cause we give childbirth something you guys will never understand....Luv YA!

 

[Marguerite53]

Gleuchhhh..... this whole thread makes me nauseous just reading it!! But I have a horrible time getting IVs in or blood drawn. Good techs are important too -- fearless ones! Timid ones I just send away. My worst was going for an endoscopy where you cannot drink anything for 12 hours -- I had to put my arms under scalding water after numerous failed tries -- I almost walked out they were so inept.

Over the years this is what I've been told. Ask for pediatric needles (they are smaller). Drink a ton of water the night before and up to blood draw. Wear long sleeves or a warm vest to warm up the veins. Sometimes these things work, sometimes they don't.

I REALLY like Duff Man's idea of wiggling your toes and counting to 10! I'll bet that my veins do constrict with anticipation of things going awry! I'm definitely going to try that (or take a Valium before I go!! I wonder if that would screw up a blood panel which I need to go in for soon?)

No one in the hospital had any trouble getting a line in. It was a breeze for some reason. Nor do I remember any troubles with all 3 deliveries with my children 20+ years ago. Just problems in doctor's offices. UG!

Thanks for starting this. I really am going to ask about a valium!!

Marguerite

 

[vhmoriarty]

Gleuchhhh..... this whole thread makes me nauseous just reading it!! But I have a horrible time getting IVs in or blood drawn. Good techs are important too -- fearless ones! Timid ones I just send away. My worst was going for an endoscopy where you cannot drink anything for 12 hours -- I had to put my arms under scalding water after numerous failed tries -- I almost walked out they were so inept.

Over the years this is what I've been told. Ask for pediatric needles (they are smaller). Drink a ton of water the night before and up to blood draw. Wear long sleeves or a warm vest to warm up the veins. Sometimes these things work, sometimes they don't.

I REALLY like Duff Man's idea of wiggling your toes and counting to 10! I'll bet that my veins do constrict with anticipation of things going awry! I'm definitely going to try that (or take a Valium before I go!! I wonder if that would screw up a blood panel which I need to go in for soon?)

No one in the hospital had any trouble getting a line in. It was a breeze for some reason. Nor do I remember any troubles with all 3 deliveries with my children 20+ years ago. Just problems in doctor's offices. UG!

Thanks for starting this. I really am going to ask about a valium!!

Marguerite

The whole prodding thing makes me sick to even think about it. I have noticed however if I am in a room with other stuff kinda going on, its easier, cause i have my mind off of it, hence the count to 10 thingy, lol.

I went through two allergy shots a week. The 72 stick thingy to find my allergies, two children with epidurals, c-section, swan cath, and everything.

And still getting a IV and blood work is torture for me. Im a wuss!

I always get them to use butterflies usually on me. So hoping this works!