Open Heart surgeries and Neurological problems

[paulyhand44]

Hello all,

I'm new here and tried searching forums but didn't notice any discussions. I apologize for my lack of medical terms.
Has anyone encountered neurological issues potentially related to being on the bypass machine during heart surgery.
I've had 3 different brain scans that have all come back as "abnormal" but my current neurologist said she couldn't give a clinical diagnosis since it appeared to effect all parts of the brain and not just certain sections as seen with most patients. I'm getting a 2nd opinion obviously but just wondering if anyone has encountered issues. A friend of the family is an anesthesiologist and says that it happens during surgery while hooking up the bypass machine but surgeons generally won't discuss it.

I've had 2 surgeries (tissue valves 1st time and mechanical 2nd time) and a TIA due to mitral valve stenosis

Thanks for your time

 

[jeffp]

Welcome Pauly.
I think a majority of us here have had some degree of “pump head”. Took me probably 6 weeks to get close to seeming normal to the outside world. Lots of lingering neurological symptoms came and went for 2 years or so. Lots of scans and MRI’s. Some normal, some with “possible signs of…”. Even this far down the road, I still have some mild residual numbness in my left hand. Was profound immediately after surgery.
The perfusionist said that no matter how much heparin they put in your system, some micro clots get through the filters and get stuck somewhere. You just notice it more in the brain; lung or GI not so much.
Hang in there.

 

[Zoltania]

I'm not convinced that the majority of us have experienced "pump head." The topic doesn't seem to come up very often. Of course, this is all anecdotal and based on impressions. We would need some kind of controlled study to give us real data.

Anecdotally, I did not experience this.

 

[pellicle]

We would need some kind of controlled study to give us real data.

would this do as a starter?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11172175/
Methods: In 261 patients who underwent CABG, neurocognitive tests were performed preoperatively (at base line), before discharge, and six weeks, six months, and five years after CABG surgery. Decline in postoperative function was defined as a drop of 1 SD or more in the scores on tests of any one of four domains of cognitive function. (A reduction of 1 SD represents a decline in function of approximately 20 percent.) Overall neurocognitive status was assessed with a composite cognitive index score representing the sum of the scores for the individual domains. Factors predicting long-term cognitive decline were determined by multivariable logistic and linear regression.

Results: Among the patients studied, the incidence of cognitive decline was 53 percent at discharge, 36 percent at six weeks, 24 percent at six months, and 42 percent at five years. We investigated predictors of cognitive decline at five years and found that cognitive function at discharge was a significant predictor of long-term function (P<0.001).

Conclusions: These results confirm the relatively high prevalence and persistence of cognitive decline after CABG and suggest a pattern of early improvement followed by a later decline that is predicted by the presence of early postoperative cognitive decline. Interventions to prevent or reduce short- and long-term cognitive decline after cardiac surgery are warranted.

 

[carolinemc]

Hello all,

I'm new here and tried searching forums but didn't notice any discussions. I apologize for my lack of medical terms.
Has anyone encountered neurological issues potentially related to being on the bypass machine during heart surgery.
I've had 3 different brain scans that have all come back as "abnormal" but my current neurologist said she couldn't give a clinical diagnosis since it appeared to effect all parts of the brain and not just certain sections as seen with most patients. I'm getting a 2nd opinion obviously but just wondering if anyone has encountered issues. A friend of the family is an anesthesiologist and says that it happens during surgery while hooking up the bypass machine but surgeons generally won't discuss it.

I've had 2 surgeries (tissue valves 1st time and mechanical 2nd time) and a TIA due to mitral valve stenosis

Thanks for your time

I would disagree with the anesthesiologist, for the heart and lung machine has nothing to do with the brain. You may have genetic issues with that abnormal brain stuff. It can be medications used that can cause some memory problems, cause I still encounter what is called pump head from being on the heart pump machine during bypass. First one, not. and it was repair. Second was the replacement of the aortic valve with a St. Jude's, but nothing abnormal of the brain.

 

[Paleowoman]

Hello all,

I'm new here and tried searching forums but didn't notice any discussions. I apologize for my lack of medical terms.
Has anyone encountered neurological issues potentially related to being on the bypass machine during heart surgery.
I've had 3 different brain scans that have all come back as "abnormal" but my current neurologist said she couldn't give a clinical diagnosis since it appeared to effect all parts of the brain and not just certain sections as seen with most patients. I'm getting a 2nd opinion obviously but just wondering if anyone has encountered issues. A friend of the family is an anesthesiologist and says that it happens during surgery while hooking up the bypass machine but surgeons generally won't discuss it.

I've had 2 surgeries (tissue valves 1st time and mechanical 2nd time) and a TIA due to mitral valve stenosis

Thanks for your time

Hi @paulyhand44 - welcome to the forum. What kind of neurological problem/s do you have ?

Some of us here developed migraine auras immediately post surgery. Cardiologist on the heart ward I was on said some people get them post surgery. Several years ago, in a discussion on the forum about these auras, I found a link which said they can be a neurological problem as a result of the heart lung (bypass) machine.

I haven't followed this up myself because the migraine auras I get are without headache so don't really bother me, but it seems there are quite a few of us that got the same post open heart surgery, the auras without headache. I also get double vision occasionally.

 

[Gkeraney]

Hello all,

I'm new here and tried searching forums but didn't notice any discussions. I apologize for my lack of medical terms.
Has anyone encountered neurological issues potentially related to being on the bypass machine during heart surgery.
I've had 3 different brain scans that have all come back as "abnormal" but my current neurologist said she couldn't give a clinical diagnosis since it appeared to effect all parts of the brain and not just certain sections as seen with most patients. I'm getting a 2nd opinion obviously but just wondering if anyone has encountered issues. A friend of the family is an anesthesiologist and says that it happens during surgery while hooking up the bypass machine but surgeons generally won't discuss it.

I've had 2 surgeries (tissue valves 1st time and mechanical 2nd time) and a TIA due to mitral valve stenosis

Thanks for your time

A few things after my first open heart. I was a great speller with something like a photographic memory. I would know exactly when I last saw a patient several years before. The date and time. I occasionally testified as an expert witness and would not need to refer to the notes. It was pretty great as the opposing lawyers knew quickly they were in trouble, if they tested the boundaries of that. I lost most of that and its a bit worse now 23 years later. Also a tremor evolved in my left hand when pointing at items, which I noticed when showing radiographic images to folks. Not my right side at all. I still have this but can work around it. Finally, I could do extensive calculations without a calculator. I now have calculators wherever I sit. I will transpose numbers and have to focus hard on picturing what I saw to not do so. For some reason, nothing got worse after the next two procedures, which is good. I am aware that mri's on tavr patients, for example, show something that can be called damage which is thought to be clinically insignificant.

 

[pellicle]

I would disagree with the anesthesiologist, for the heart and lung machine has nothing to do with the brain.

The above sounds less general than I intended, so allow me to rephrase it as:

so if one was to put a choke hold (in say a typical Juijitsu move) on someone, and although their heart doesn't stop beating and I'm not doing anything to the brain why does the person pass out?

I'm glad that you see it ok to tell us you don't know about INR management and leave that to the experts (but then tell us something about it anyway) but are willing to say that an anaesthesiologist knows less about the big picture than you.

We're privileged to have such wisdom here.

BTW, where do you stand on the pill box issue?

 

[V__]

Some of us here developed migraine auras immediately post surgery.

My migraine frequency doubled after surgery. Instead of 2/month it's now 4/month. It's not terribly problematic (and it wasn't an issue previously). But I do record the occasions, so pretty certain of this observation.

About the only preventative measure that helps is hydration, especially in the morning.

 

[pellicle]

My migraine frequency doubled after surgery. Instead of 2/month it's now 4/month. It's not terribly problematic

any thought to trying chiropractic?
I found good relief there (although that discovery was an accident, I went because of neck injuries from bicycle accidents)

 

[V__]

any thought to trying chiropractic?

In the past I did, for over a year. Didn't change migraines at that time (way before surgery).

Your comment in another thread, about eliminating tension, was interesting though.

My migraines are mild though, just a moderate headache later in the day, after an aura episode. Some people need "to lie flat" for a day, with a horrible headache. That seems quite tough...

 

[pellicle]

My migraines are mild though, just a moderate headache later in the day, after an aura episode.

interestingly mine seldom have any headache.

I've got a friend who is debilitated by them (he hasn't had OHS).

I'm glad also not to get that, I've got enough problems ;-)

 

[Superman]

Hi @paulyhand44 - welcome to the forum. What kind of neurological problem/s do you have ?

Some of us here developed migraine auras immediately post surgery. Cardiologist on the heart ward I was on said some people get them post surgery. Several years ago, in a discussion on the forum about these auras, I found a link which said they can be a neurological problem as a result of the heart lung (bypass) machine.

I haven't followed this up myself because the migraine auras I get are without headache so don't really bother me, but it seems there are quite a few of us that got the same post open heart surgery, the auras without headache. I also get double vision occasionally.

I think aura’s are fairly common among those of us with BAV. I’ll grant that’s it’s been over 30 years and it is a data point of one, but I know I used to get them as a teenager before I ever had my valve replaced. My valve was in pretty bad shape at the time. My son gets them occasionally, but he’s in his early 20’s now and has a fairly mild presentation. Still just annual checkups with no talk of intervention. I don’t think a doctor would have noticed anything yet were it not for me.

 

[Paleowoman]

I think aura’s are fairly common among those of us with BAV. I’ll grant that’s it’s been over 30 years and it is a data point of one, but I know I used to get them as a teenager before I ever had my valve replaced.

Hi Superman - I never had migraine auras before heart surgery, they started the day after !

 

[Superman]

Hi Superman - I never had migraine auras before heart surgery, they started the day after !

That’s interesting. Don’t take my memory as gospel on it either. The majority of my life now is post surgery so I could be getting my timeline’s wrong. My son, however, I know hasn’t had anything done.

 

[Paleowoman]

That’s interesting. Don’t take my memory as gospel on it either. The majority of my life now is post surgery so I could be getting my timeline’s wrong. My son, however, I know hasn’t had anything done.

Yes, the cardiac doctor on the heart ward I was on said they often happen after heart surgery.

I did a search and found link I posted back in 2014 about neurological problems following heart surgery which are due to the heart lung/bypass machine: Neurological Complications Of Heart Surgery I quote one particular sentence of interest: "For example, possible complications from bypass surgery include vision problems, paralysis, hoarseness, movement disorders and disturbances in learning, memory, attention, concentration and mental agility.” (my bold) It doesn't say what the 'vision problems' are.

 

[Unicusp]

I think aura’s are fairly common among those of us with BAV. I’ll grant that’s it’s been over 30 years and it is a data point of one, but I know I used to get them as a teenager before I ever had my valve replaced. My valve was in pretty bad shape at the time. My son gets them occasionally, but he’s in his early 20’s now and has a fairly mild presentation. Still just annual checkups with no talk of intervention. I don’t think a doctor would have noticed anything yet were it not for me.

Very interesting. I recall getting the auras starting back around age 17. Went to ophthalmologist and tried to describe the temporary fuzzy blindness and got no answers. He was baffled. I never had migraine pain. Then had those auras on and off my entire life, with less occurrence up until my aortic valve surgery. Can't recall having any since. Correlated? I don't know.

 

[carolinemc]

so if I choke you (in say a typical Juijitsu move) and your heart doesn't stop beating and I'm not doing anything to your brain why do you pass out?

I'm glad that you see it ok to tell us you don't know about INR management and leave that to the experts (but then tell us something about it anyway) but are willing to say that an anaesthesiologist knows less about the big picture than you.

We're privileged to have such wisdom here.

BTW, where do you stand on the pil

You need to stop bullying people have a different opinion. You have no wisdom, just a hateful person. Just stop the harassing when someone has a different opinion. You hate people a lot I see. Sad.

 

[Jean Mallory]

This is very interesting. I have what I called ocular migraines for years. Usually affecting just one eye, no pain just blurriness and flashing. Now they are called migraine auras. But some say auras effect both eyes. I am three months out from a tissue aortic valve, along with a mitral valve repair. The ocular migraines increased significantly in the first few weeks out, along with dizziness and blurry eyes. Now it seems the episodes are decreasing. My doctors are not knowledgeable about this and I am not worried about it . Just find it interesting that others are experiencing it.

 

[pellicle]

You need to stop bullying people have a different opinion. You have no wisdom, just a hateful person. Just stop the harassing when someone has a different opinion. You hate people a lot I see. Sad.

you mistake correcting what is wrong for hate.

I don't hate you, I don't actually hate anyone. The world isn't as binary as you seem to see it as. In fact you are the one going around hating and angry facing things ... reflect on that for a moment before you go right ahead and click angry on this. Pick up the new testament and have a quick read about what is called forgiveness and tolerance.