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tbillfund

can anyone tell me what side effects there can be from going on the heart lung machine. Ever since my surgery 4 years ago I have had difficulty with balance and have extreme dizzy spells which prevent me from walking even 10 feet. Can one suffer brain damage from going on the heart lung machine.
 
Hello and welcome to the forums.

I've never heard of anything quite that drastic, but given some thought, I would think it is possible. I'm not well versed in this area, so I'll let others comment on it.

:)
 
Hi tbillfund-

My, my, we have a lot of monied friends here, richie rich and tbillfund. Send some my way, please!

Welcome to the sight. You'll love the friendships that are developed here.

Just wondered if you have had a recent echo cardiogram. The reason that I ask is that my husband had similar symptoms. The first time prior to his mitral valve replacement and the second time it turned out to be a leak in his mechanical mitral valve around the sutures. He had a repair done, two stitches I think, and the dizziness went away.

He would actually spin around with his spells. It was a terrible feeling for him.

Also have the doc check out your carotids.

I hope it's nothing serious, but please do follow up with the cardiologist and let us know what he says.
 
pump

pump

Recient studies show that the effects of a dulled memory can last up to five years. In my case they found I had been having small strokes each time I went under. Leaving behind small dead areas in my brain. So now the big ? is is it the drugs used in OR or is it the pump itself. Doesn't much matter now. Nor do I care, I am still alive!

Luckily most people dare I say all the people on this site havent had as many surgeries as I have!!

Dizzyness can also be caused by a med thats just not quite right for you. Nancys suggestion is an excellent one.
 
I am one of the biggest PUMPHEAD's there are on this site...I will get in my car and forget where i am going...I lost my keys for 2 1/2 months, I take papers out and lose them 2 seconds later. The bad part is...instead of getting better...I am getting worst. I think it has something to do with the pump, rest, and stress. I have had a lot of stressors in my life, I haven't been getting enough sleep, and I had heart surgery a year ago, and will be going in for oral surgery tomorrow. So I am stressed. Take it easy, maybe you should talk to your cardio about all this stuff, they are supposed to help you out with a lot of this.
 
T-Bill - I am two years post-op and still get dizzy sometimes. I have no problems with memory and everything else seems normal. When I ask two cardiologists about it, both said it was not heart related. I was never dizzy before surgery, just after. Please let me know if you find information about your condition, since yours seems to be similar, but more severe.
 
Have ears checked

Have ears checked

Tbill, Go to Toronto and see the top ENT specialist.at the University. I think your problem is in the labyrinth and likely nothing to do with the "pump". I had a cousin with these symptoms a few years back who finally saw a specialist in Boston who cured her of her disabling vertigo but he had to wipe out the bad ear to do it.
 
A very good friend of mine is head of the perfusion group at the hosptal where I had my AVR done (he actually ran the pump during my surgery).

We have had several long discussions about the effect of pump time. The big concern seems to be with patients under going repeat surgeries and the effects of cumulative pump time. There was a study that was released about two years ago at the time
of my surgery that reinforced some of the concerns, but I'm told it was based on a relatively small sample size. I hear that there is a lot of on-going research in this area.

What my friend is telling me is that there is tremendous amount of work going on to develop non-pump procedures, particularly for coronary by-pass patients. Pretty hi-tech stuff using robotic surgery, etc. He jokes that if he's glad that he only has a few more years to work, otherwise he would probably be out of a job at some point.

Personally I felt less than sharp for a couple of months after my surgery. I could never tell how much was attributable to the surgical trauma, drugs, pump time or just old age (as my kids frequently suggested).

Merry Christmas,

Mark
 
MArty, intersting information. Not sure if it applied in my case though.

I would say about a year before I found out I had valve problems, I was getting feelings of vertigo, tho I didn't know what it was at the time. I got to where I was afraid to drive, because I would be driving along and all of a sudden it felt like my car was leaning to one side. I went and had my car checked twice, because I thought it was the car. I truly thought my car was screwing up!

Then two years ago I found out about needing valves replaced. I had my surgery and though I do sometimes get dizzy spells, I no longer have this vertigo feeling when I'm driving, Thank Goodness! That was scarey. I was on a 7 hour trip heading to Northern Wisconsin three years ago and the trip took me about 10 hours because I would only go 45mpg's down the highway. Of course I thought it was the car at that time. I ended up taking the rural roads too, just so I wouldn't end up getting in an accident on the tollways! Of course the first thing I did when I got to my destination was get the car checked out, and it was fine. The mechanic and I took the car for a drive and it drove beautifully. Mechanic probably thought I was nuts, because then I drove the car and said, "See, don't you feel the tilting? " The car wasn't tilting. It was me!

MArkU, what you posted is interesting too. I would be very happy if I were to need surgery again, if I had a non-pump procedure. Of course, I hope it doesn't come to that I will need surgery again. I too was less than sharp for a few months.
Merry Christmas everyone!

God Bless!
 
I posted this a while back regarding the heart-lung machine and brain problems.


"Pumpheadedness" study---help on the horizon??
Doctors Test Post-Bypass Memory Drugs

Story Filed: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 7:10 AM EST

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Call it brain fog, that loss of memory and thinking ability that strikes tens of thousands of patients after open-heart surgery, and sometimes other big operations, every year.

Now doctors are studying if giving patients certain drugs just before a heart bypass could prevent this mental decline by essentially protecting the patients' brain cells from the rigors of surgery.

The clinical trials mark a turning point: For decades, doctors didn't know what to make of patient complaints that in getting their hearts fixed, something hurt their brains.

Today, few doubt it's a real problem that affects not just heart patients but those undergoing other major surgeries, too, such as hip or knee replacements. Often, patients recover. But one study found 42 percent of heart-bypass patients suffer significant drops in mental sharpness that can last not just months but years. Other research suggests 10 percent of hip-replacement patients suffer similar mental decline.

In some ways this ``postoperative cognitive dysfunction'' is a byproduct of the modern operating room. As surgery -- particularly the half-million heart bypasses performed every year -- has become increasingly successful, aftershocks such as a muddled brain draw more concern.

``It's a big quality of life issue,'' says Dr. James Cottrell, president of the American Society of Anesthesiologists.

No one knows yet what's to blame. It may be that only certain people are at high risk, such as those whose brain blood vessels are starting to clog and something about surgery speeds up the disease.

For now, suspects range from the heart-lung machine that circulates bypass patients' blood -- it can dislodge tiny bits of fat, blood clots or air bubbles that flow to the brain -- to the inflammation and post-surgery fever that are a risk after any major operation.

Surgery's stresses spark inflammation and other reactions that ``in some ways is the body's way of healing itself,'' explains Dr. Mark Newman, anesthesiology chairman at Duke University and a leading expert on post-surgery mental decline. ``But the question is if it goes beyond a certain level, do you end up with problems?''

That's where much of the prevention research centers: If surgery even temporarily blocks oxygen in part of the brain or sparks severe inflammation, the body reacts with a chemical cascade that injures or kills brain cells.

Newman and other scientists are studying if injecting patients with one of three different medications before a bypass could block that chain reaction and spare brain cells:

--Two small studies suggest lidocaine, normally used for irregular heartbeat, can prevent bypass patients' brain fog. Duke now is testing 250 bypass patients, half given lidocaine and half not, to see who has better brain function a year after surgery. Newman says lidocaine might work by blocking a pathway that lets toxic doses of calcium flood into oxygen-deprived brain cells.

--Certain levels of magnesium seem to block that toxicity, too, as well as lessen cell damage from inflammation. So, using federal money, Duke is enrolling 400 bypass patients into a study to see if magnesium might block brain fog.

--Initial testing of an experimental drug called pexelizumab, thought to block an inflammation-causing immune system protein, showed bypass patients who received the drug had slightly less mental decline. Duke and several other hospitals are participating in a 3,000-patient study of pexelizumab, sponsored by the drug makers Alexion Pharmaceuticals and Procter & Gamble.

Some companies also are testing if filters put onto heart-lung machines can help by keeping debris from flowing to the brain.

Until those studies are done, Newman advises patients worried about coming surgery to ask their anesthesiologists about one step believed to lower brain risk -- rewarming their cooled-down bodies more slowly than usual after the operation is done.

The key is intense temperature monitoring that tells when the brain, which warms faster than other organs, reaches 98.6 degrees, Newman explains. At that point, doctors should stop warming and let other organs gradually reach normal temperature on their own.



EDITOR'S NOTE -- Lauran Neergaard covers health and medical issues for The Associated Press in Washington.



Copyright © 2002 Associated Press Information Services, all rights reserved."
 
heart lung machine.

heart lung machine.

Well you have all given me plenty to think about and follow up. . Have learned that since surgery that the sac covering the brain and spinal cord (the dural) has started to expand due to increase in cerebal fluid. They believe this may be part of the problem and are continuing to test me. I do get echos done every 6 months and all repairs to the heart show no more leaks from the valves.
Again thank you everyone your replys are very much appreciated
 
Last edited:
tbillfund....

tbillfund....

RE:

Have learned that since surgery that the sac covering the brain and spinal cord (the dural) has started to expand due to increase in cerebal fluid. They believe this may be part of the problem and are continuing to test me.

Today I was released from the hospital after 3 days and various tests.

I had a terrible episode of vertigo that lasted at least between 5 to 8 minutes (plus chest pains and S.O.B.).

They say that 'everything' checked-out O.K. (sometimes it makes me wonder) and that It's probable that I'll never experience this again.

The explanations that I got as potential causes seemed greek to me.

One hour before this esisode I had been driving on the freeway (the most congested freeway in the nation). Now I'm not too sure if I should keep doing so.

Ya'll, is there a 'spray' or something that one can spray into the mouth (or elsewhere) that'll 'snap' you out of vertigo?

"tbillfund," what was the prognosis on your tests?

god Bless all
 
Hi Cruiser-

Did anyone mention TIAs or Transient Ischemic Attacks to you? They can cause something like what you experienced. They are small blood clots that can form, possibly on your valve, and break off and pass through the brain. They last about the period of time you mentioned, then go on their way and leave no permanent problems.

They are frightening when they happen. My husband has had about 15-16 of them. However, he hasn't had any recently, thank God. Since he got his mitral valve repaired, they have not returned. Each time he went to the ER, they had already cleared up, and nothing showed.

They can have various symptoms. I'll mention a few that Joe has had. They were all temporary.

Vertigo

Blindness in one eye

Blindness in both eyes

Stabbing pain in his head

Speaking "garbage", unintelligible words

Not remembering how to do simple things like winding up the garden hose

Falling out of bed

Confusion

If your doctor has mentioned TIAs to you, it is very important that your Coumadin is in good control. Joe had to see a neurology specialist. Interestingly enough, the specialist was able to tell us exactly what area of the brain the clot had traveled from the symptoms we told him. He was on Plavix for a short time. But not on that any longer.

Of course it is also possible that it is something else.

Take care, Marco.
 
Results of my test were that I have dural estacia. I am taking meds that help reduce the presure in the dural sac. To some degree the meds help but the problem increases in the winter months and improves during the summer. They don't know why.
They guess that it may be due to larger swings in barometric presure during the winter.
Nancy I thought about your comments regarding small clots and I have discuss this with the doctors. My INR has been very stable at about 3.0 to 4.5 for the last 4 years. My target is 3.0 to 3.5
 
Hi tbill-

Strangely enough, Joe's INR was in range also during that time, but he had the TIAs anyway. INR was always among the first test they did. The neurologist put him on Plavix to make the blood more "slippery", in addition to Coumadin. All of the doctors have told us that he must stay close to his range. I do think it might have been the leaking mitral valve that caused them. All I know is they're gone, and I hope, never to return.

I am sure there are many reasons for them. Several people here have had them.

They're not a fun thing and we spent hours in the ER.
 

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