Bleeds???

[Cooker]

Hello All,

I have read and heard folks talking about bleeds. Are these from injury or do they just happen? Are the internal or external like nose bleeds etc?

My INR has pretty much always been in range and I have cut myself and there does not seem to be a big change in the amount of bleeding. It takes a little longer to stop but not much. I can spot an external bleed but what are syptoms of internal bleeds?

Thanks,

Tom

 

[Ross]

Major drop in blood pressure. General feeling of something isn't right. Visual disturbance. Those are the not so obvious.

The obvious is visually seeing blood in stools or elsewhere that would alarm a prudent person to take action. I'm not a prudent person.

 

[Cooker]

Major drop in blood pressure. General feeling of something isn't right. Visual disturbance. Those are the not so obvious.

The obvious is visually seeing blood in stools or elsewhere that would alarm a prudent person to take action. I'm not a prudent person.

Thanks Ross. One question I left out is how common are they and do they occur when INR is in range?

Thanks,

Tom

 

[Karlynn]

Cooker,
They are not common and not something that everyone experiences. What we tell people is that you aren't going to just start bleeding spontaneously from an INR of 5 or less (and it's my opinion that it's higher than that). You almost always would have to have something that would bleed eventually anyway - ulcers, lesions etc. Some people have reported finding cancer much ealier than they would have, had they not been on Coumadin. People that report bloody noses probably have some sort of vascular weakness in their nose to begin with. I haven't had a bloody nose in the 15+ years I've been on warfarin and I've had some incidences of fairly high INR's.

I think this whole fear of just spontaneously having blood pour out of your body because you take Coumadin is something that many in the medical community still hint at.

My experience is like yours- any cuts or abraisions I get don't bleed any long than normal for me to even give it much thought.

 

[Ross]

I have to agree with Karlynn, I know of no spontaneous bleeds. It may well be a good early detection tool to other problems. Looks like I was well on my way to a big time ulcer that has now been prevented due to a bleed.

 

[Joe]

Tom, I also have a St. Jude mechanical , have had for 6 years now and was subject to nose bleeds,usually in the mornings . My primary doc attributed this to dry nostril passages and suggested a bit of vaseline in each nostril at bedtime. Worth a try for those having this problem. Good old coumadin, I just love it.HA !
Guess I'd better it helps keep my ticker going.

JOE

 

[Blanche]

Albert was hospitalized for esophagal bleeding caused by acid reflux. He woke one morning ( 7am) complaining about hearing funny sounds in his heart. We got him to the cardiologist about 9am. After examining him and taking an ekg, the dr said he had no problem.

We went to a restaurant for a bite. The waitress mentioned that Al looked pale and tired. I assured her that all was well because we had just come from the doctor. Later, about 1pm, Al was getting ready to take a nap when he fainted and crashed into the bathroom cabinet. By then, his blood pressure was very low, which is what caused the faint.

Paramedics took him to hospital where he was given 3 bags of blood. The next morning a colonoscopy and an endoscopy showed the problem. Prior to this problem, Al's INR had been in range for nearly 3 months. He had been testing weekly with no changes to his dose.

He remained hospitalized for 6 days until his INR got back in to range....because he was given Vitamin K as well as the blood. The doctor did say on Friday that he thought it would be Ok for Al to go home for the week-end with an INR of 1.9. I agreed that it would be just fine, provided that the doctor take him home with him. I was purple with rage about the vitamin K and I think I scared the dickens out of our doctor. He agreed with everything I said after that.

I need to make it clear that the Coumadin did NOT cause the bleed. Acid reflux damaged his esophagus. Once he started bleeding, the bleeding increased because he was anticoagulated.

Blanche

 

[Bina]

My INR was at 3.4 most of the winter....I had some very minor nose bleeds and they were only due to the overly dry indoor air. I need a new humidifier for next winter!

 

[Joe Cool]

Saline spray is my BEST friend. I have less nose bleeds now than I did BEFORE my surgery! You can use it as much as you like. I have heard some negative things about chronic Vasaline use in the nose. This quote is from Wikipedia about petroleum jelly:

"It may immobilize the cilia in the nose, impeding its ability to clean incoming air. As well, if small particles of petrolatum are inhaled from the nose, they may deposit in the lungs and lead to a condition called lipid pneumonia."

Occasional use probably won't hurt, but use prudence.

I use my nose as a second INR meter. If I start to see a little pink, it usually means that I am on the higher end of my range. More blood means that I am getting too high. But, that is just me. It won't be the same for you. I would rather see a little pink, than hit a 1.4 like I did a couple of weeks ago

 

[catwoman]

Saline spray is my BEST friend.

My husband depends on saline spray, because CPAP machine use dries out his nasal passages. (He's not on warfarin.)

Warfarin patients who suffer from occasional nosebleeds during the winter might consider keeping saline spray on hand.

 

[kbheart]

When I left the hospital I used an electric razor as the coumadin book had suggested. The book had me terrified of cuts. After a couple months I had enough of the thing so I used a regular razor. Sure enough, a few weeks later I cut myself shaving. By the time I crawled out of the shower to get a kleenex, I couldn't find the cut. It had stopped bleeding immediately. So much for regular razors being terribly dangerous!