pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
I guess that this is a taboo subject, but what if just "5h1t keeps happening" after surgery?
or is that a bit tough a topic to discuss?
or is that a bit tough a topic to discuss?
what if there isn't a transition back to normal life?
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Jkm7
Well-known member
It isn't and shouldn't be a taboo topic.
It is important for us to grasp and accept the risks.
My fear before each of my two OHS was not I would die but that I might not........ I far more feared a
poor outcome and failure to return to productive, high quality of life.
Didn't most of us worry just a tiny bit we might not achieve a full recovery?
It is important for us to grasp and accept the risks.
My fear before each of my two OHS was not I would die but that I might not........ I far more feared a
poor outcome and failure to return to productive, high quality of life.
Didn't most of us worry just a tiny bit we might not achieve a full recovery?
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
Jkm7
indeed, my view was the same: not dead but worse off.
One of my friends had an infection set in a few months post surgery and after ultimately a full sternum removal has found a way to live with all of it now in his late 70's. His family reported a long (nearly 10 years) period of darkness and depression. His wife died some 5 or so years after his surgery and I'm sure that made going on harder.
I'm in a similar position to him (although being about 10 years younger at the time of surgery). Having had 2 surgeries which went well I'm now wondering if I'm in the "two out of three isn't bad" situation. I am quite sure that if my wife had died before my surgery in 2011 then I would not have elected for the surgery and allowed nature to take its course.
I will report as time goes on if things are getting better or not.
indeed, my view was the same: not dead but worse off.
One of my friends had an infection set in a few months post surgery and after ultimately a full sternum removal has found a way to live with all of it now in his late 70's. His family reported a long (nearly 10 years) period of darkness and depression. His wife died some 5 or so years after his surgery and I'm sure that made going on harder.
I'm in a similar position to him (although being about 10 years younger at the time of surgery). Having had 2 surgeries which went well I'm now wondering if I'm in the "two out of three isn't bad" situation. I am quite sure that if my wife had died before my surgery in 2011 then I would not have elected for the surgery and allowed nature to take its course.
I will report as time goes on if things are getting better or not.
After 50+ years of practice thru millions of surgeries, and tremendous improvements in the "art and science" of OHS, the odds of a full transiition back to normal life are as good as they get. It's a "glass half full" proposition....not a "glass half empty".
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
I agree
but the post operative infection and subsequent wound and ongoing wound treatment are bringing me down (its also quite uncomfortable having my dressing changed with the hair plucking and the flesh sticking to the foam) ... as is the lack of certainty if "they have got it all" and the possibility of ongoing treatment ... and other assaults on my mental health (just by the bye).
Back before August I was more a glass half filled sort of guy.
My outlook on my recovery on the last surgery (1992) was much more positive. But then it didn't have complications and I simply got better. Same was true of my operation when I was 11 or so years of age.
ski girl
Well-known member
Try to think about these complications that are worrying you this way:
Can you control them? No. Control what you can. Eat well, keep as fit as possible, do what you need to do to stay positive and happy (if that involves a psychologist, do it). Like dicko said, surgeons have been doing this op for decades, it's not tricky for them.
CONTROL WHAT YOU CAN!
Can you control them? No. Control what you can. Eat well, keep as fit as possible, do what you need to do to stay positive and happy (if that involves a psychologist, do it). Like dicko said, surgeons have been doing this op for decades, it's not tricky for them.
CONTROL WHAT YOU CAN!
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
good advice ... perhaps you've seen me give it recently ;-)
tried two thought they were somewhere between pathetic and dangerous ... at hospital they asked if I'd like to speak to a psychiatrist, who seemed to feel that given all the criteria I was about as balanced as he'd expect.
correct ... but it can be less than ideal for me.
will try to keep that in mind.
My point here is that sometimes its not the disney world of perfect recoveries and a small percentage does go "less than ideal". My purpose is not to monger fear among pre-surgery people but to attempt to discuss my issues without being told to deal with it, sit in the back seat shut up and it will all get better.
So while this may not be a taboo subject I believe it puts many to the test. In the main people here have had few or minor complications. Just as other people expressing worries in pre-surgery seem to expect (and often get) some advice for how to cope I was sort of hoping for the same here.
Jkm7
Well-known member
Depression and heart surgery/heart disease seem to have a close relationship.
After my heart attack and first surgery, the first question my cardio asked at my first appointment was 'how are you handling the depression'? Being new to heart disease/heart surgery and having had no warning or opportunity to read/study in advance, I had no clue depression is so common among us heart patients.
If you have sought consultation with mental health professionals and have not found adequate assistance, perhaps you have not consulted with the right one for you.
I would not presume to say if you are or are not depressed but it might be something to consider.
You have been through a lot and continue to require more care and treatment than any of us would want. You have every reason to have a down day or two and no one would be surprised by it.
This heart surgery is tough stuff and anyone who says differently has not been through it once let alone twice or more.
I 'hear you' and understand your frustration and desire to get on with the rest of your life and put all this behind you.
Please know I send all best wishes.
After my heart attack and first surgery, the first question my cardio asked at my first appointment was 'how are you handling the depression'? Being new to heart disease/heart surgery and having had no warning or opportunity to read/study in advance, I had no clue depression is so common among us heart patients.
If you have sought consultation with mental health professionals and have not found adequate assistance, perhaps you have not consulted with the right one for you.
I would not presume to say if you are or are not depressed but it might be something to consider.
You have been through a lot and continue to require more care and treatment than any of us would want. You have every reason to have a down day or two and no one would be surprised by it.
This heart surgery is tough stuff and anyone who says differently has not been through it once let alone twice or more.
I 'hear you' and understand your frustration and desire to get on with the rest of your life and put all this behind you.
Please know I send all best wishes.
JiFaire
Well-known member
At the risk of sounding stern, pellicle (where have you heard that before?), I suggest that you follow your own very sage advice, my friend.
Your honest and wise council lifted me when I was first facing this, and I wish that I could somehow do the same for you. You have a life to live, to honour the loved one who believed in you so much; you'll get through this, and somehow find the strength to accept your new life, so that you might continue to bless others with your thoughts and views. I suspect you have a great many friends whose lives are entangled with yours; certainly, you have made an impact here.
As for me, I'm a bit selfish in that regard; I go in next Wednesday, and I want to talk about it all with you once I'm out. If I have post-operative infection or complications, I want to be able to read how you got through it, and follow in your footsteps. If I get depressed, I want to read that this too shall pass.
For what it's worth, you're in my thoughts and prayers; I suspect many others have you there, as well. We're not letting you go easily
Your honest and wise council lifted me when I was first facing this, and I wish that I could somehow do the same for you. You have a life to live, to honour the loved one who believed in you so much; you'll get through this, and somehow find the strength to accept your new life, so that you might continue to bless others with your thoughts and views. I suspect you have a great many friends whose lives are entangled with yours; certainly, you have made an impact here.
As for me, I'm a bit selfish in that regard; I go in next Wednesday, and I want to talk about it all with you once I'm out. If I have post-operative infection or complications, I want to be able to read how you got through it, and follow in your footsteps. If I get depressed, I want to read that this too shall pass.
For what it's worth, you're in my thoughts and prayers; I suspect many others have you there, as well. We're not letting you go easily
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
Hi
yes, its something I only learned of recently too ...
thanks
it is genuinely appreciated.
Just had my wound dressing changed today and that was both painful and painful to be dealt with by inexperienced home nursing people who seem to have no idea of proper 'sterile technique'.
Sometimes ignorance is bliss in that one does not get frustrated knowing any better .... I guess I'm not being a very patient patient at the moment.
But seriously the way my life has gone this last year and a half I just don't know what the benefits are for struggle.
yes, its something I only learned of recently too ...
thanks
it is genuinely appreciated.Just had my wound dressing changed today and that was both painful and painful to be dealt with by inexperienced home nursing people who seem to have no idea of proper 'sterile technique'.
Sometimes ignorance is bliss in that one does not get frustrated knowing any better .... I guess I'm not being a very patient patient at the moment.
But seriously the way my life has gone this last year and a half I just don't know what the benefits are for struggle.
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
thanks mate, nothing like a firm kick up the butt with your own boot ;-)
anyway, I'm glad I was able to do something positive for another.
there are a couple. Actually we are all a bit down after August ... me more so. It is indeed to them that I have promised not to act in any self harming way. Not that I am (and I stress this) suicidal, but FFS sometimes its just SFH to put that foot in front of the other. And I keep asking "why" : why me, why so hard, what did I do to deserve this, why why why ...
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JiFaire
Well-known member
Understood; but you'll get through this, and carry the good stuff with you always. It's not supposed to be easy. Again, much respect.
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
Hi
thanks mate ... I guess no matter what I'll write about it. No matter what I've had a life which so far would be more than many ever get a chance to.
Some dribble on that can be found starting here: http://home.people.net.au/~cjeastwd/personalHome.htm
thanks mate ... I guess no matter what I'll write about it. No matter what I've had a life which so far would be more than many ever get a chance to.
Some dribble on that can be found starting here: http://home.people.net.au/~cjeastwd/personalHome.htm
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
PS
my basic problem at the moment is that the infection I had (in the wires at the front of the sternum) may or may not have been succesfully removed
The surgeon is concerned that it may have been dragged to either into the sternum or behind the sternum by removal of the wires (he did the procedure). We can only keep up the antiobiotics and watch and wait.
mean time the wound heals under the vacpac
and I have no idea if they'll simply have to open that up again any time soon or not.
The bacteria is described in Wikipedia as:
my basic problem at the moment is that the infection I had (in the wires at the front of the sternum) may or may not have been succesfully removed
The surgeon is concerned that it may have been dragged to either into the sternum or behind the sternum by removal of the wires (he did the procedure). We can only keep up the antiobiotics and watch and wait.
mean time the wound heals under the vacpac
and I have no idea if they'll simply have to open that up again any time soon or not.
The bacteria is described in Wikipedia as:
ski girl
Well-known member
AGH Pellicle I have managed to miss a big part of your story! Commiserations . . . .
I had a very rocky recovery after my 2nd OHS (acute endocarditis caused an emergency redo of my 11-month old AVR, with a 30% chance of living). At one point the docs even tried to kill me - I was tachycardic and they loaded me with amioderone for 18hrs, then knocked me out with the drug that killed Michael Jackson and did a cardioversion which brought my HR back down to 75. Funny enough, THEN the amioderone kicked in and I was a code blue within an hour.
However if it helps, I'm now at the point where that horrible experience is just a good story to tell! I hope that you will get there too
I had a very rocky recovery after my 2nd OHS (acute endocarditis caused an emergency redo of my 11-month old AVR, with a 30% chance of living). At one point the docs even tried to kill me - I was tachycardic and they loaded me with amioderone for 18hrs, then knocked me out with the drug that killed Michael Jackson and did a cardioversion which brought my HR back down to 75. Funny enough, THEN the amioderone kicked in and I was a code blue within an hour.
However if it helps, I'm now at the point where that horrible experience is just a good story to tell! I hope that you will get there too
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
God that's terrible.
With any luck they will be more successful with me if I get endocarditus
With any luck they will be more successful with me if I get endocarditus
Julian
Well-known member
Wow thanks for bringing this up in a less than round about way. I'm not one that likes to dwell in the what ifs and negative thoughts but sometimes these thoughts are just overwhelming. Several years ago I went through a bad depression and anxiety episode. Brought on from drug use and relationship gone wrong. I was a mess for 2 years. I had these thoughts I was going to hurt someone or myself. Dark times... I would speak with others that have gone through similar and they would agree it's horrible beyond words and the only defense is stay busy, positive, and know that eventually it will pass... For me eventually it did but it was a slow subtle change and to an extent never fully went away.
Fast forward to last year after surgery all the same feelings of depression and anxiety came back. Maybe not as bad as before but also a bit different. The first few days in the hospital were hell on earth by the way. It was tough to read all the miraculous recoveries most were making in the first few months and I was still feeling not well. Generally speaking my recovery was bump free in a sense but still sucked for some reason.
What seen me through the whole thing was my faith in Jesus Christ and trusting the text in the Bible. I had to know that I endure the pain now for the joy that is set before me. Now 16 months post op I'm having many more good days than bad and I suspect it to continue to trend that way.
One thing is for sure, everyone's recovery is different. This surgery is freaking nuts no matter how far we've come in medicine and when they mess with your heart there is a part of you that is changed for this lifetime and it can be a good or bad thing. Basically like anything else in life, it is what you make out of it. Try to be at peace bro this too will pass. The struggle is worth it. The world needs you. You have a purpose and a destiny. This is something I have to remind myself everyday.
Fast forward to last year after surgery all the same feelings of depression and anxiety came back. Maybe not as bad as before but also a bit different. The first few days in the hospital were hell on earth by the way. It was tough to read all the miraculous recoveries most were making in the first few months and I was still feeling not well. Generally speaking my recovery was bump free in a sense but still sucked for some reason.
What seen me through the whole thing was my faith in Jesus Christ and trusting the text in the Bible. I had to know that I endure the pain now for the joy that is set before me. Now 16 months post op I'm having many more good days than bad and I suspect it to continue to trend that way.
One thing is for sure, everyone's recovery is different. This surgery is freaking nuts no matter how far we've come in medicine and when they mess with your heart there is a part of you that is changed for this lifetime and it can be a good or bad thing. Basically like anything else in life, it is what you make out of it. Try to be at peace bro this too will pass. The struggle is worth it. The world needs you. You have a purpose and a destiny. This is something I have to remind myself everyday.
pellicle,
My first question is - Are you still on antibiotics? I have some knowledge about the vacuum pump as my husband was attached to one, but not heart related. Do you have an infection control doctor? If not see if you can see one. They are quite specialized in fighting any type of infection in a body. I have you in my prayers.
My first question is - Are you still on antibiotics? I have some knowledge about the vacuum pump as my husband was attached to one, but not heart related. Do you have an infection control doctor? If not see if you can see one. They are quite specialized in fighting any type of infection in a body. I have you in my prayers.
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
Julian, you're welcome.
As an Australian I can say that of the many characteristics of North Americans (Canada and USA) there is one which can be a strength and a weakness. It is their propensity to only talk things up and never want to discuss the dark sides.
Some people do well with their head in the sand as the method of dealing with the darkness which can occasionally overwhelm. Sadly all too often 'mericans respond to this with simple directives such as "get a counselor" or "get therapy". Sadly this is flawed and in many ways simply dismissive. People seem to wish to get benefits and pats on the back from mutual interaction but decreasingly offer a shoulder to lean on or an ear to listen.
I have been spending some time doing research (my Masters was one area of that) and my examinations of the social science area has not left me feeling that anything like the same rigor and veracity is applied to it as in the harder sciences (such as Chemistry where I came from).
What I'm saying is: don't rely on psych services. You will find a lot of variation among practitioners AND you will also meet many how have sought psych services who will report (at best) "that you will need to try many before you find one who fits your needs"
Lucky its not like that with heart surgeons.
pellicle
Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
Hi
thanks. I guess that after this year I can honestly say I'm not sure I believe in that anymore, but I know it won't cause any harm. This has been a tough year for me with my Father (cancer, expected outcome, time to get used to it) then my Wife (sudden death from unknown brain cancer) passing away. God did not once answer my prayers about my lovely wife. I can only say that I feel that if there is a God then he/she seems to want to punish and torment me for some reason.
Sorry to seem 'heart on sleeve' but I thought it appropriate to disclose WHY my mental state may seem more negative than 'just an infection on my chest' warrants.
Yes, I am. 500mg Amoxycillin every 8 hours.
I do, and he was chosen by my surgeon. I was hospitalised for a little over a week from the night of the surgery. I was on IV antiobiotics which varied from vancomycin to timintin and then penicillin.
thanks. I guess that after this year I can honestly say I'm not sure I believe in that anymore, but I know it won't cause any harm. This has been a tough year for me with my Father (cancer, expected outcome, time to get used to it) then my Wife (sudden death from unknown brain cancer) passing away. God did not once answer my prayers about my lovely wife. I can only say that I feel that if there is a God then he/she seems to want to punish and torment me for some reason.
Sorry to seem 'heart on sleeve' but I thought it appropriate to disclose WHY my mental state may seem more negative than 'just an infection on my chest' warrants.
