Selecting a Surgeon

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A

ALCapshaw

I was diagnosed with moderate to severe Aortic Stenosis one year ago. It has progressed to severe and I'm wondering how VR survivors chose their surgeons / hospitals?

Is there a way to find statistics on surgeons and hospitals? Such as number of procedures perfomed per year, mortality and morbidity rates? What questions do you recommend asking potential surgeons?

'AL' (58 yr old male)
 
Hi Al,

Choosing the type of valve you want to replace the bad one. Finding the hospital, and looking for surgeons is the hardest part of this whole thing. For me it was easy, I live in durham, north carolina. I new that duke was graded number six in heart. My cardio, is one of a group who call themselves the valve team. So, they know the best choice of surgeons. For me, I new that I wanted a homograph. This is a human cadaver valve. There are several choices. So, I needed to find a surgeon that was comfortable doing this kind of surgery and skilled enough. I was lucky to find him easy to deal with and talk to. How many of these had he done was my first question. What would the procedure be like. How long would my surgery be. What about my recovery. What about the different incesions. These are all good questions to start out with. Some in the group choose to travel to there hosptial. Others felt that staying close to home was a better choice. It depends where you live, and if there are good people in your area. If you like your cardio and have confidence in him/her. Then talk to that person and ask them for recommendations. There are wonderful people in this group that I'm sure that can shed more on this subject. If I can be of any more help, please let me know. martha
 
Hi Al-

When you make your own personal survey of cardiothoracic surgeons, also include some local facilities. Everyone knows about the huge centers, but not everyone knows that there are many, many fantastic high volume local facilities with expert surgeons who can offer the same services and give you the conveniences of being closer to home plus the "hand-off" to the cardiologist is a smooth transition. That's important and when you have to go back to see the surgeon for your scheduled checkups it's easy as pie. If you have after surgery glitches which are common, no matter where you have your surgery, if the surgeon is local, it's so much easier to contact them and schedule an appointment.

My husband has had 4 cardiothoracic surgeries within 20 miles of our home, 2 heart valves, and 2 lung surgeries. Several years ago, he also had a heart valve done in Boston which is about 3 and one half hours away, and I know he thought it was a big hassle.

He couldn't be happier with the results of his local surgeries and they were technically very difficult, but we have great local surgeons and facilities.
 
Thanks for the replies Martha and Nancy.

I found the USNEWS Heart Hospital Rankings and was pleased to note that the University of Alabama at Birmingham Hospital is ranked #13, behind #6 Duke in NC and #9 Emory in Atl, GA. Are there other ranking lists?

UAB is a nationally recognized teaching hospital and heart transplant center. Birmingham is a fairly easy 100 mile commute from my home in North Alabama. I was refered to one of the top surgeons there but would like to be able to compare statistics (number of various procedures performed, morbidity rates, etc.) between some of their surgeons with some of the local (Huntsville AL) surgeons. I have NOT been able to find any statistics on individual SURGEONS. Is such information publicly available? If so, where?

I must take a moment to brag about the excellent heart care services available in relatively small Huntsville AL (home of NASA's rocket center and high tech industries) centrally located in North Alabama between Birmingham and Nashville. We have 35 cardiologists and 5 surgeons who are all overloaded with patients, reflecting an aging workforce (and unhealthy eating habits). The Heart Center has 27 cardiologists and is the largest cardiology group in the SE USA. Our
Cath Lab is state of the art and is frequently visited by representatives of much larger cities for study and emulation. The surgeons are pleased to allow trained members of our local MENDED HEARTS Chapter do patient visits BEFORE and after surgery, noting that seeing and talking with survivors goes a long way towards alieving anxiety and providing HOPE for patients facing surgery.

'AL'

Bypass '99
Aortic Stenosis
 
Hi Ross,

Thanks, Glad I saw your post. Iw as just getting ready to send those sites to Al, and my computer went down. So, now I finally get back on, and you have saved me the task. So... <smile> thanks to you!

Al, Glad to hear that you have a top rated hospital near you. I went to Vanderbilt in Nashville, and it was rated #32 at the time. It is a teaching hospital, and they did a wonderful job for me.

Wishing you luck, success and confidence with your selections!

Rob
 
Last edited:
Hi again,

I had some additional information that you may want to read regarding selecting a surgeon.
Some of the info does not completely relate to Vavle Replacement surgery, but you can formulate simularities.
So..... Here goes...

Re: How to research a doctor
by Richard999 (WebMD), 3/28/01 7:15 PM
Questions to ask:
How long has he been in practice?
Will he be scrubbed in during the entire procedure, or does a PA (physician assistant) open and/or close the patient?
** Note: This isn't a sticking point. I'd just like a board certified cardic surgeon opening my sternum) **
How many CABG (coronary artery bypass graft - pronounced cabbage) procedures does he perform in a year?
** I personally assist on 150-200 CABG and valve procedures a year **
Does he/his group perform off pump CAB's? (Is it an option for your mother?)
** This is something that is relatively new. There isn't a lot of long term data. However, in my opinion, off-pump patients just seem to "look" better. The problems with neurologic deficit seems to be virtually eliminated thanks to removing the heart/lung machine from the picture. It does however require practice. Anastimoses are slightly more difficult on a beating heart. Anesthesia support is also something to consider. (meaning more skillful perioperative pharmacological management.) **
How long are his pump runs?
** (1-2 hrs is acceptable) **
How long are his cross-clamp times?
** (30 min - 45 min is good) Less time the better. **
What is his patient mortality rate?
** In other words, how many patients have serious complications peri-operatively & post-op? ** Complications should include, but not be limited to, wound infections, stroke, and death. **
How long does an average CABG take him to complete? (On and off pump)
** From the time the patient enters the Operating Room, until the time she leaves. Expect anywhere from 3-5 hours. **
How long is the average hospital stay for his CAB patients?
** Varies quite a bit, patient to patient, but less is always better **
Does he try to get his patients up and about ASAP - post op?
** Old school thinking was that patients needed lots of rest, but research has found that getting patients up and out of bed helps get them home quicker. **
Does he or his assistant utilize a bridging technique for taking saphenous (pronounced saffenous) vein?
** The leg incisions will probably cause more pain than the sternum. Bridging cuts down on the amount of tissue that is incised, and promotes better healing. **
Does he or his assistant utilize an endoscopic vein harvesting technique?
** Another relatively new technique. Very little of the skin needs to be incised for this method. **
Of course, you may have some other questions you might find important, but these are questions that I myself would like to have answered if I were having a CABG.


THIS IS ALSO GOOD TO KNOW!

Insider Tips for Finding a Good Surgeon

One of the most important decisions you will make in life is choosing a surgeon to operate on you. However, most people know more about the quality of work done by their car mechanic than the quality of work done by their surgeon. And that is truly a scary thing. Unfortunately, there are many bad surgeons out there who are perfectly willing to do an operation on you without having the proper skills, training, and experience.

The picture is not totally hopeless, though. There are plenty of surgeons who have great results and excellent reputations, especially with other surgeons. Make no mistake, every surgeon knows who they would send their loved ones to if they needed an operation and, also, who they wouldn't send their dog to.

So how do you find out who these surgeons are that other surgeons go to when they need an operation? Read on to learn the steps that you can use to find a really good surgeon, even if you are new in town and don't know anybody you can trust to give you good information. I use these tricks myself when I need to find a surgeon for family members who live out of town.

1. Find the True Insiders

Who has the best insider information on who is a good surgeon and who is a bad surgeon? It's not the nurses in the hospital or doctors' offices or the town magazine that publishes the yearly good doctor list or the primary care doctor who is sending you to a surgeon in the first place. It is the surgical residents that work in hospitals. These are young doctors that have graduated from medical school and are doing five to seven years of intensive learning (up to one hundred hours per week) in one area of surgery before going out on their own to open practices. They spend most of their work hours assisting the more senior surgeons in performing surgery and taking care of the patients in the hospital during the night hours.

2. Make Contact with an Insider

This step calls for some boldness. Call the main telephone number of all the hospitals in your area where you might have surgery between 8 p.m and 9 p.m. on a weeknight. This is after the supper hour, but way before the residents turn in for the night. Ask the page operator for the name of the resident that is on call that night who is responsible for the patients who have had surgery similar to your upcoming procedure. Then ask the operator to page that resident to an outside phone line and stay on the line until the resident picks up his phone call.

3. Ask for Help

This calls for even more boldness. Take a deep breath and say the following, "Hello, Doctor So-and-so, I am new in town and I need surgery and don't know any good doctors. I'm wondering if you could help me? This conversation is strictly off the record. Who would you send your mother to if she needed surgery?" Doctors are naturally helpful and this will allow the resident to give you the name of the best surgeon in their own mind, without getting themselves into trouble for passing judgment on their superiors. Every doctor, no matter how junior, has the right to say who their choice of surgeon is for their mother without fear of getting in trouble for being "too uppity." Do not ask, "Is Doctor Blank a good doctor?" Or, "Who are the good surgeons?" as the resident will probably being afraid of his answer getting back to the wrong person and likely will not help you.

4. Prepare for Rejection

If the surgical resident you reach does not seem willing to help you or seems hassled and rushed, don't push. Apologize for interrupting him or her and say good night. You really want to talk with somebody who will take a minute and think over your request and not just blurt out some name to get rid of you. Remember, getting the name of a bad surgeon is worse then getting no name at all.

5. Prepare for Success

If, however, the resident seems friendly and open to talking to you and gives you his recommendation, tell him you really appreciate it. Then say again that your conversation is off the record and ask him for his second choice of surgeon. If he gives it to you, you have hit the jackpot. Make sure before you hang up that you have written down the correct spelling of the surgeon's name so you can call the hospital operator back later and get that surgeon's office phone number. Do not risk irritating the resident who has just helped you (and spoiling it for the next person using this strategy) by asking the resident to look up phone numbers for you.

6. Do it Again

Make calls on consecutive nights to each hospital you are considering having your surgery at. This will allow you to develop a list of good surgeons and will usually let you avoid getting a resident you have already talked to. If two or more residents give the same name to you as being good enough for their mother, you have hit the double jackpot. Although even the best surgeons have some bad results, it is a good bet that your chances for a good outcome with a surgeon recommended several times by the residents will be greatly increased and you will be in the best possible hands.


Aren't Choices Wonderful!

Rob
 
Al - I figured I was going through this one time and just looked for the best. I went to Cleveland and Cosgrove based on the best information I had. Two things I would look for if I were you. One is a hospital and surgeon that does this all the time and the age of the surgeon. I found surgeon age information on the CCF web site. I think the mortality rates would only confuse since no one wants to admit being a bad surgeon and statistics can be misleading. Anyway, good luck with the search.
 
Here's a question for all of you who have already had surgery. I know that some of you did travel out of state or whatever ... and I'm wondering how tough it was to travel home post-surgery (especially if it involved air travel).

I'm lucky enough to have great insurance (knock on wood) ... and can probably go to Cleveland or Mayo if I wanted. But, after flying on business last month, I really can't picture going thru all of that hassle at the airport after having major surgery. Not to mention that I'm sure the takeoffs -- and the airline seats -- are *wonderful* with a wired-shut sternum.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Heather
 
Al-

The things that Rob posted are good questions. Some tweaking is necessary because you probably aren't having a straight CABG procedure. I was on the pump 4 hours. But the Ross Procedure is a long surgery. valvereplacements with mechanical and tissue valves don't take nearly as long.

Personally, I am leary of sites that list "The Best" docs. Some of those, although I have not checked the ones Ross listed, are "fan clubs" for certain docs, run by that doc's practice and loaded with his/her patients. Docs compile stats and stuff for research to make themselves look good. I didn't want to be just another stat.

If you know any physicians personally, ask them who'd they'd go to if it was them, or their dad etc. This is the best way to tell. Interview as many docs as you want. They work for you.

The surgeon( David Heimansohn) who did my Ross had not done millions of Rosses(40 or so) but all the ones he had done had excellent outcomes, as had all of the AVR's(300) he had done. He was self-assured without being too cocky. He just said, he was good at these surgeries. So far he has been right.
The other guy I was going to use, John Brown at Indiana University, does about 3 Rosses a week, most of them are pediatric cases, he is extremely competent, but has surgical fellows do most of the surgery. Heimansohn did the whole thing. I liked that. Plus, no med students came around to bug me.


I guess my point is that I feel as though I have had a great surgery and I did not go to any doctor from a list, or to CCF or Mayo or Oklahoma City. I talked to docs in Indy recommended by my cardiologist. There are a lot of competent skilled surgeons out there, and there are a lot of bozos, too. Only you can decide who you want to do your surgery. Don't feel pressured by outside forces, even me. Go with what feels right to you.
Good hunting!
-mara
 
Statistics

Statistics

Hi Al,

One of the ways you can get information about the surgeon and the hospital is to address your questions to the Office of Administration in the hospital. I understand that they are required to give you certain information such as the number of surgeries the doctor does per year, outcomes, ratio of nurses to patients, etc.

I didn't find this out until after my surgery, and since I wasn't having any problems, I never followed up on it.

Basically, I went with the surgeon that my cardiologist recommended, after doing some inquiries on my own. I found 3 local people who all used this same surgeon and raved about his ability and the care they got.

Of course I like my cardiologist very much and trust him completely. If he thought this guy was the right man for the job I needed done, that carried a lot of weight for me.

Good luck in finding someone you feel totally confident in using.

Ron K
 
Selecting A Surgeon

Selecting A Surgeon

Mara, Rob, Ron, and Ross -

Thanks for the GREAT information and recommendations !

The HealthGrades.com website gives The Univ of ALA at Birmingham Hospital (UAB) a 5 star rating for valve replacement surgery :) I then decided to ask my Cardiologist and Primary Care Physician for more details.

My cardiologist called me back to answer some of my questions and indicated the surgeon he recommended was one of the two senior surgeons at UAB. He told me he has had good success with both and I could choose whichever one I wanted. This cardiologist has gone out of his way to 'be there' for me on several occassions. I especially appreciate his willingness to tell me what he thinks.

My Primary Care Physician told me one of her family members just had emergency valve replacement at UAB and she was extremely impressed with the doctors, nurses, and support staff. One of her relative's nurses had worked in the heart surgery unit for 22 years (they like to recognize and reward loyalty and competence). She helped me bridge the gap between acceptance of my fate to being comfortable with my choices. I'm ready to set a date.

Thanks again for the suggestions and support. VR.com is a GREAT resource.

'AL'

p.s. Ron K - did you receive my private note?
 
Al,

There are many very capable cardiovascular surgeons in most large cities. I am fortunate to live within 1 1/2 hours of both Memphis and Little Rock. There were many surgeons to choose from with good reputations.

I got on the phone and called people I knew from these areas who had valve replacement and inquired about their surgeons. This led to further references to people they knew. I was not hesitant to call people I didn't know to get their recommendations. In addition to published information this is how I decided on the surgeon and the cardiologist, both in Little Rock. My cardiologist has training from Cleveland Clinic; my surgeon has experience at Mayo.

I did travel to Cleveland Clinic for a final evaluation including a "fresh" echocardiogram. I wanted to feel confident about the information my surgeon had to work with pre-surgery.

Dave M
 
Got it!

Got it!

Al, I got your private message the other day and answered it. Check your private messages. It may be attached to your origianal message. Let me know if you can't find it.
Ron K
 
Private Message

Private Message

Ron K,

Either I can't find your private message or I don't know where to look. Can you copy it as a text message and send it to me as an e-mail?
Send to [email protected]

Thanks, 'AL'
 
Hospital and Surgeon Choices

Hospital and Surgeon Choices

Hi Al,

I've read through all of the good advice you have received here, and I gather you feel comfortable with the services in B'ham. I certainly can't argue with that. However, if you need another choice, I highly recommend the team at St. Thomas Hospital in Nashville. Dr. Michael Petracek installed two SJM valves for me in 1993, with no blood transfusion, and all went extremely well. My cardiologist is Dr. Andre Churchwell at St. Thomas.
 
Thanks for the Nashville information / recommendation Jim. That's about the same distance from my home as B'ham. I remember seeing St. Thomas in the USNEWS top 50 heart hospitals.

Your comment about NO transfusion caught my eye. I hope to have another meeting with Dr. Kirklin (son of the founder of the Kirklin Clinic) to go over some of the details, such as transfusion, opening and closing, second valve choice in case the Bovine Pericardial is not viable, etc. My family doctor also suggested inquiring as to how long they would accept my latest catheritazation results without putting me through yet another one. It's not a big deal, but, I would just as soon not have to have so many...

'AL'
 

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