Facing a 2nd operation

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pekster11

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Apr 20, 2011
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249
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Chester, UK
Hi
well as you know if you've read any of my posts and clicked through to read about me I've had a career of 3 OHS, starting at 10 and my last one was at about 48. I had a repair, a homograft and finally a mechanical; each spaced about 15 to 20 years apart.

The reality of the world when I was 28 was there there was no Point of Care INR monitoring (as there is today) which would have meant that if I'd been advised towards a mechanical valve back then I'd have been facing: being chained to an INR clinic and weekly or so vein blood draws. I know that would have been bad.

Equally I knew when considering my 3rd OHS at 48 that I didn't want to have a 4th because while it would be better than death from avoiding a failing tissue prosthesis and death from SVD, no operation needed would be better. So picking a mechanical valve was pretty much a no brainer to my frame of reference.

I say, to younger people here time and time again that compared to the already old (meaning those over 60) the actuality of our choices is quite different. I'm actually nearing 60 but my valve has now done 12 years of operation and of course shows no sign of failing.

Reoperation in itself is not the problem; the problem is the cumulative interior damage created by the inevitable scar tissue and the stuff left lying around and the increased risks of infections (contributed to by the scar tissue).

If you met me you'd probably say "wow, you don't look like someone who's had 3 heart sugeries. In part that's because I had really good surgical care and really paid attention to maintaining my health.

This is a site founded upon the concept of patients who are sharing what they have experienced; so it should seem strange when someone who had their first operation at over 60 who has never been on warfarin and how doesn't manage it in any way (doesn't even self test) will tell you about how bad that option is; while never having had a reoperation and crowing about how my valve is still good at 9 years. As if 9 years is a long or good amount for measuring the rest of your life by.

The following is predicated on the fact that you are not "contra-indicated" for warfarin (which is rare, but exists).

My advice to you is this: you've already kicked the can down the road and found that SVD is actually real and the statistics do indeed apply to you. You need to look past the surgery into the next 20 years. Sure if you pick a mechanical valve you'll be managing your INR for the rest of your life. If you don't pick a mechanical valve you will most assuredly be going to testing again looking for SVD and so basically (if you recall the process that led to your current situation) you'll be setting yourself up for that again.

Is that the future you want?

I recommend you to read my blog post here about choices (make sure you don't miss Dr Schaffs old presentation here)

and here about the facts of INR management.

SVD is also increasingly linked to Lp(a) as I understand it, so if you have higher Lp(a) then choosing another bioprosthesis would be like expecting something different by doing the same thing as last time.

Lastly there is no definitive cure for valvular heart disease, we only exchange it for prosthetic valve disease; of which there are two main branches. One is managed by future surgeries the other is managed by you managing your INR.

Let me show you some glimpses of my life after mechanical on self management of INR

Going to the local micro brewery at Mt Alford


Explaining life in Finland to my Australian mates

(because I lived in Finland on and off both before and after surgery)

A common trip on my eScooter to hike Queen Mary falls

(this time followed by my mate on his bicycle to record it, I do this trip a couple of times a week in summer)

So in my view, learn about the actual outcomes and make you choices on the actual data (not just a perception of them)

Lastly I often hear "but I'm so active, I can't choose a mechanical", are you more active than Veronika?


because the above "...I'm so active..." is based on a presumption that's simply false.

Whatever you choose to do, I hope you have a typical event free surgery and a smooth recovery.

Best Wishes

Hey, I was thinking of you when I watched this video recently 😂😂

 

KyleR

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Jun 16, 2018
Messages
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Location
Louisville, KY
Just a follow up. I met with the surgeon a few weeks ago and there was some discrepancy with the pressure gradient numbers between my most recent echo and TEE, so he ordered a cath diagnostic test to get the most accurate reading. The cath test came back with a mean pressure gradient of around 40 so apparently I am now officially in the severe stenosis range. Since I am asymptomatic and do not have any other issues both my surgeon and cardiologist are recommending a "watchful wait" with another echo scheduled in 6 months. If symptoms develop sooner than that then that would change the equation but as of now neither seems to be in a rush to jump into surgery. Personally I'm ok with that as we have a 10 month old at home and this gives my wife and I (hopefully) some time to plan things out.

My surgeon did of course suggest a mechanical valve this time around given my age and prior surgery, and I am in agreement with that. With my original surgery he had to enlarge my root so he said this time around he would need to replace both the valve and part of the aorta. While I guess this does add to the complexity of the surgery it does alleviate my concerns about a 3rd operation down the road due to an aortic aneurysm. He did say that if a 3rd operation is ever needed though then it would be tricky with the graft in place, but I'm not sure exactly what he meant by that. I don't want to worry about a 3rd operation before I've even had my 2nd, and with a mechanical valve I'm certainly hoping this will be my last, but can anyone elaborate on why the graft may cause issues down the road with another operation? I thought I had read here before that some members have had grafts replaced but I could be mistaken.
 

pellicle

Professional Dingbat, Guru and Merkintologist
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Nov 4, 2012
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Queensland, OzTrayLeeYa
Morning

.... With my original surgery he had to enlarge my root so he said this time around he would need to replace both the valve and part of the aorta. While I guess this does add to the complexity of the surgery it does alleviate my concerns about a 3rd operation down the road due to an aortic aneurysm.

surprisingly little ...

He did say that if a 3rd operation is ever needed though then it would be tricky with the graft in place, but I'm not sure exactly what he meant by that.

I'd have asked, but he may be meaning that any future surgery will be about aneurysm expanding further up the aortic artery. If this gets closer to the arch (like mine) then it can be difficult because there is a lot of vascular surgery in putting on all those arteries.


... I thought I had read here before that some members have had grafts replaced but I could be mistaken.
yes, it happens, but it is of course less straight forward. Like driving on an empty road vs driving in traffic.

Best Wishes with the surgery and I hope the recovery is uneventful.
 

tom in MO

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Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
2,089
Location
MO USA
Just a follow up. I met with the surgeon a few weeks ago and there was some discrepancy with the pressure gradient numbers between my most recent echo and TEE, so he ordered a cath diagnostic test to get the most accurate reading. The cath test came back with a mean pressure gradient of around 40 so apparently I am now officially in the severe stenosis range. Since I am asymptomatic and do not have any other issues both my surgeon and cardiologist are recommending a "watchful wait" with another echo scheduled in 6 months. If symptoms develop sooner than that then that would change the equation but as of now neither seems to be in a rush to jump into surgery. Personally I'm ok with that as we have a 10 month old at home and this gives my wife and I (hopefully) some time to plan things out.

My surgeon did of course suggest a mechanical valve this time around given my age and prior surgery, and I am in agreement with that. With my original surgery he had to enlarge my root so he said this time around he would need to replace both the valve and part of the aorta. While I guess this does add to the complexity of the surgery it does alleviate my concerns about a 3rd operation down the road due to an aortic aneurysm. He did say that if a 3rd operation is ever needed though then it would be tricky with the graft in place, but I'm not sure exactly what he meant by that. I don't want to worry about a 3rd operation before I've even had my 2nd, and with a mechanical valve I'm certainly hoping this will be my last, but can anyone elaborate on why the graft may cause issues down the road with another operation? I thought I had read here before that some members have had grafts replaced but I could be mistaken.

Per your watchful waiting, make sure you know the symptoms that requires you to get immediate treatment. For your 6 month echos, make sure you get follow-up reports, sometimes doctors forget to check results and/or call.

When it comes to a 3rd operation, from what I've picked up, the more work done in and around a valve makes additional work more complex for several reasons that are individual in nature (e.g. scar tissue) and may never apply to you. We all heal in different ways and had different work do. You are wise to "don't worry about a 3rd operation before it's even needed."
 

Peej

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2021
Messages
45
Good luck Kyle. I'm down the road a bit. I opted to have my surgery done at Cleveland Clinic though I went the mechanical route in hopes of being one and done. No regrets on choosing CC but also was going to chime in to say I'm sure you'll be fine staying local. Traveling to CC can take a bit more time to get the ball rolling.
 

tom in MO

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Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
2,089
Location
MO USA
Well, so much for the "watchful waiting". Surgery is scheduled for June 16th. Not looking forward to the operation and immediate aftermath, but definitely looking forward to getting it behind me.
Best of luck.
 
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