81 mg aspirin no longer recommended?

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Protimenow

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Unfortunately, I don't think that there is a test to determine platelet 'stickiness.' It would be helpful to know both INR and platelet functions, but I don't think that a test exists.

I'm disappointed that someone, years ago, chose to describe coumadin/warfarin as a 'blood thinner.' It doesn't thin the blood and un-anticoagulated blood is not 'thicker.' What they mean is not thinness but clotting time.

Unfortunately, when people talk about blood thinners, some people think of 'viscosity' as an effect that 'blood thinners' cause. It's not like 30 weight oil vs. 20 weight.

I wish that, somewhere in the past, they chose a more accurate term, so people aren't confused about what warfarin does to blood.
 

Warrick

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Seems there is testing to check platelet response to aspirin-


I guess calling warfarin a blood thinner is where the myth of “warfarin makes you colder” nonsense developed,
my father thinks warfarin makes his blood thinner otherwise it wouldnt flow thru his valve, despite me telling him the real reason he’s believed this for over 30 years so he aint gonna change.
 
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pellicle

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It seems there should be a blood test(s) (there are) to indicate whether you should or you shouldn't. It has to do with clotting and viscosity, and there are tests for both.
I'm unaware of anything we normally take which influences viscosity ... I believe this is a mis-assumption from the miss use of the term "blood thinners" ... they aren't thinned
 

Warrick

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I thought Id look up blood vicosity itself and found this, so blood viscosity can change but nothing to do with warfarin

As part of my googling I came across the bullshit on this site

Read about poor “Mellanie” and the dangerous life shes living on warfarin, what a crock,
note the piece on diet recommendations OMG
no wonder people have the fear of god put into them when you read this stuff.

Im not sure what a coumadin emergency is , and Iv had no nasty side effects, the only side effect Iv experienced thus far is becoming a reasonably well informed INR manager, and.. oh yea.. Im still alive
 
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rich01

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I'm unaware of anything we normally take which influences viscosity ... I believe this is a mis-assumption from the miss use of the term "blood thinners" ... they aren't thinned
You're right in that aspirin doesn't reduce viscosity. I thought it did, but it appear that statins do reduce viscosity. I know that grounding does and try to ground often.

I take 2 81 mg aspirin a day, had some blood drawn a few days ago for lab tests, and stopped bleeding almost immediately. If that is a valid test, it doesn't appear aspirin is effecting clotting very much.
 

CThrock

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My Cardiologist has never said for me to stop taking it. What can it hurt? So why the uproar about it. If your Cardiologist days you don't need it the don't take it. I've been taking it for 14years I don't have a problem with it. Guess it's your own performance.
 

Protimenow

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I don't think that there is an uproar about taking 81 mg aspirin. I posted this because it sounded like an interesting argument.

I'm still taking 81 mg a day, and don't plan to stop.

(That article on StopAFIB was an amazing crock of (I can't say the word in four letters, because it would be blocked) bullshit. But it DOES help highlight the broad range of misunderstandings of anticoagulation that saying 'blood thinner' causes. It reads almost like an ad for Eliquis and other anticoagulants used for AFib).

At the bottom of this crock is a list of articles that supposedly were the sources of information -- none relate to anticoagulation. It kind of makes me wonder where the hell the author learned this ****.
 
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btlRickas01

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Not with a coated aspirin or a children's aspirin.
The coated aspirin moves the bleeding problem from the stomach to the intestine.

I think a lot of people here need to have a discussion with their general practitioner as well as their cardiologist. This is not a simple question to answer especially when other meds are taken into account.
 

carolinemc

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The coated aspirin moves the bleeding problem from the stomach to the intestine.

I think a lot of people here need to have a discussion with their general practitioner as well as their cardiologist. This is not a simple question to answer especially when other meds are taken into account.
That is uncoated aspirins, I know from my mother taking them for RA(Rheumatoid Arthritis). Coated aspirin coats the stomach and intestines. People prefer coated aspirins due to the coating the stomach and helps prevent stomach upset.
And thank for the advice to talking to their doctors', cardio, gp, and any other specialist they may be seeing for other health issues. It is a necessity when taking other meds for medical conditions.
Hugs for you today.
 

carolinemc

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You're right in that aspirin doesn't reduce viscosity. I thought it did, but it appear that statins do reduce viscosity. I know that grounding does and try to ground often.

I take 2 81 mg aspirin a day, had some blood drawn a few days ago for lab tests, and stopped bleeding almost immediately. If that is a valid test, it doesn't appear aspirin is effecting clotting very much.
What aspirin does is thins the blood. There have been some studies to suggest for some patients to stop the aspirin regiment as it thinned to blood too much, and that can happen to some of us.
 

carolinemc

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I thought Id look up blood vicosity itself and found this, so blood viscosity can change but nothing to do with warfarin

As part of my googling I came across the bullshit on this site

Read about poor “Mellanie” and the dangerous life shes living on warfarin, what a crock,
note the piece on diet recommendations OMG
no wonder people have the fear of god put into them when you read this stuff.

Im not sure what a coumadin emergency is , and Iv had no nasty side effects, the only side effect Iv experienced thus far is becoming a reasonably well informed INR manager, and.. oh yea.. Im still alive
What a coumadin(warafarin) emergency is, when the INR(protime) numbers are so low, that you risk a very serious bleed.
I know about the fake science on many different medications have been popping up lately. Even for Type 2 diabetics on Metformin, saying that they are not prescribing anymore these days. Bologna. I still take metformin everyday. I feel horrible for missing even one dose. Junk science could kill people if they followed the misinformation.
 

carolinemc

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I'm unaware of anything we normally take which influences viscosity ... I believe this is a mis-assumption from the miss use of the term "blood thinners" ... they aren't thinned
Warafarin and coumadin are called blood thinners, cause they do thin the blood. Protime, INR is to see how slow the clotting takes when using a blood thinner. If your blood take too long to clot, then it is a clot emergency and you have a small cut on the finger, and keeps bleeding without stopping, that is the blood being too thin and cannot clot properly. And aspirin can to do the same thing. Ask your cardio and nurse, they will tell you. I have been on warafarin since 2001.
 

carolinemc

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Unfortunately, I don't think that there is a test to determine platelet 'stickiness.' It would be helpful to know both INR and platelet functions, but I don't think that a test exists.

I'm disappointed that someone, years ago, chose to describe coumadin/warfarin as a 'blood thinner.' It doesn't thin the blood and un-anticoagulated blood is not 'thicker.' What they mean is not thinness but clotting time.

Unfortunately, when people talk about blood thinners, some people think of 'viscosity' as an effect that 'blood thinners' cause. It's not like 30 weight oil vs. 20 weight.

I wish that, somewhere in the past, they chose a more accurate term, so people aren't confused about what warfarin does to blood.
Aspirins are blood thinners also. If the blood is thinned out by medication and food intake, you can have a emergency when you cut yourself and can't stop the bleed, thus having to go to the emergency room. The reason it Coumadin and aspirins are called blood thinners, it the time it takes for a clot to form. If it takes a longer time to clot, your coumadin doses increase in mg, and if you are taking in more Vitamin K foods, your coumadin doses get reduced and more testing is required till the INR(protime) numbers are back to a stable level. You bruise more easily with Coumadin(warafarin) and aspirins. Education is the key. The more you learn, the more you know.
 

Warrick

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“What a coumadin(warafarin) emergency is, when the INR(protime) numbers are so low, that you risk a very serious bleed.”

@carolinemc dont you mean high?
A high protime or inr is the bleeding risk, low is clot risk increases
 

Protimenow

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Anticoagulants DO NOT THIN BLOOD. Blood Thinner is a term that misidentifies what anticoagulants do.

When you talk about 'thinning,' the converse is 'thickening.' When we talk about 'thinning,' we're talking about viscosity -- a 20 weight motor oil is thinner (lower viscosity) than a 40 weight motor oil (higher viscosity). The 40 weight oil IS THICKER - it doesn't pour as quickly, it sticks to engine parts better than 20 weight oil, and it sticks to parts at higher heat and pressure.

Viscosity does not apply to what anticoagulants do.

Anticoagulants affect factors that cause the blood to coagulate. Anticoagulated blood is not thicker than normal blood -- it just takes longer to clot.

The higher the INR gets, the longer it takes for the blood to clot. Above a certain point, there is a risk of internal bleeding. There's increased bruising. There may be blood in the urine. Perhaps having an INR that is too high may result in what that ridiculous article in StopAFIB called a 'clot emergency.'

Conversely, for those of us who have mechanical valves, having an INR below 2 can produce an extremely devastating situation -- clots can form on the valve or the portion where the valve attaches to the blood supply. These clots can break free, causing strokes or pulmonary emboli, or other life threatening events.

Regular testing (I suggest weekly, in most cases, or more often if you change sources of warfarin, drastically change diet, take antibiotics, or in other situations) is essential to manage INR. Self testing is the least disruptive way to do this (much easier than going to a lab or clinic).

No, aspirin is not an anticoagulant (and certainly NOT a 'blood thinner') It works differently from warfarin. Its results can't be determined using meters or lab tests. It affects clotting through an entirely different mechanism than warfarin does -- it makes platelets less 'sticky.' The result of too much aspirin would be increased clotting time, and this is why medical professionals are careful when prescribing NSAIDs (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs) to people taking warfarin.

As Carolinemc said: "Education is the key. The more you learn, the more you know. "

But if the source of your 'education' is bogus (like the StopAFIB site), 'learning' from them doesn't make you know more - it makes you 'know' erroneous information.

Others here have stated, and repeated, ad nauseum, accurate information about what anticoagulants do, the function of aspirin in relation to clotting, why 'blood thinner' is an incorrect term, why 'blood thinners' don't affect blood thickness (viscosity), and other important facts in relation to our mechanical valves and managing our INR.

Many of us on this forum have mechanical valves, and trust our lives to getting accurate information. Much of the information (especially that from Pellicle and many others) is accurate. Stuff from other sites, where the main motivation is ad revenue, have no reason to give accurate information. Worst case - some sites may exist to get ads from companies that manufacture anticoagulants for people with AFib and use erroneous or intentionally inaccurate information to make warfarin look bad, thus driving sales of alternative anticoagulants. They can't be trusted. Their BS is debunked here. They can't be trusted as reliable, accurate sources of information.

Repeating false, erroneous, potentially dangerous 'knowledge' does none of us any good.
 

Protimenow

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That is uncoated aspirins, I know from my mother taking them for RA(Rheumatoid Arthritis). Coated aspirin coats the stomach and intestines. People prefer coated aspirins due to the coating the stomach and helps prevent stomach upset.
And thank for the advice to talking to their doctors', cardio, gp, and any other specialist they may be seeing for other health issues. It is a necessity when taking other meds for medical conditions.
Hugs for you today.
Enteric coated aspirins don't coat the stomach. They've got a coating that prevents the stomach acids from dissolving it. Enteric coated aspirins dissolve in the intestines, and the aspirin is absorbed in the intestines.
 

Keithl

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But there is evidence that even coated aspirin can cause intestinal bleeding. All I know is 20+ years with no issues, I elect to stay on it.
 

Protimenow

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I don't believe that aspirin, dissolved in the intestines, causes intestinal bleeding. The bleeding issues are in the stomach. Taking a pill that doesn't dissolve in the stomach bypasses the gastric bleeds that some untreated aspirin can produce. That's why people take the enteric coated aspirin.
 

skeptic49

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I take a daily 325 mg coated aspirin due to a history of small strokes prior to AVR. I have had no side effects. I have a tissue valve and I am not on anti-coagulants. I also understood that low dose aspirin was recommended for clot prevention for those with tissue valves not on warfarin. I plan to continue with the aspirin regimen.
 
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