Anxiety about running!

[Steph]

I have a question for you runners, but all advice is greatly appreciated (runner or not). First a little back ground. I am a 44 year old female, I work as a personal trainer and teach spinning classes, lead hiking groups etc...., in other words I am VERY active. I have Mod-severe MR, and I am having a lot of trouble running lately. On the flip side I can sit on a spin bike and ride with ease for 1 to 2 hours. I have not run much over the last year (maybe once a week). I met with my cardio yesterday and we are scheduling a TEE and halter monitor. In addition to that my cardio wants me to begin a running program from scratch. Three times a week, run until I have to stop, and see if my times or distance improve. That part is easy. Here is the problem. I have a VERY high heart rate. When I run my heart rate is what usually stops me. For me 90% should be around 158 bpm and my max ?should be? 166. It is not unusual for me to reach the 180-184 if I allow it. Of course I am not supposed to allow it to get that high. But for this exercise my cardio does not want me to worry about my heart rate. EASY for him to say!! He wants to set up a controlled situation with running to see if I am becoming intolerant to exercise or if I am just out of shape for running. All of this should be very easy for me but it is not. I am too close to the situation and have so much anxiety and fear about what is going on that I can not think clearly about this. My cardio has very little concern about my heart, I trust him.

Does anyone else have a naturally high heart rate?
What tricks can you suggest to keep my heart rate lower?
How do you calm your anxiety so that it is out of the equation?

I do not know if any of this makes any sense to anyone, I am rambling, thinking out loud. Sorry about that. I am thankful that I have found this forum, you have all taught me so much, and it is nice to have so many great people to bounce things off of. With luck I am many years from joining the zipper club, not that you?re not a great group, I would just like to stay on the outside for as long as possible!

Steph

 

[mtkayak]

Hey Steph,

First off sorry you having anxiety over this. I was going to say diet (no caffine) and exercise can lower your overall resting heart rate but you probably already know this. What is you resting heart rate? How about doing a stress test for your Card as well? I think that is key. Of course I'm 7 months Post Op and my heart rate has come down since because it usually higher after surgery. I'm not a runner but I do like to walk and jog a lot. My heart has been all over the map since I started back jogging. I usually have to maintain a slower pace to stay within my target. Sorry, this probably isn't much help but there should be some runners that will reply soon.

 

[Steph]

Thanks Mike for your reply! I do limit my caffine to one cup of coffee a day. It has been a long time since I checked my resting HR so I will do that tonight. It was around 48. My appt yesterday was a follow up from a stress test in August. My MR was worse after exercise, he stopped the test when I reached 166 (hr) and felt that that was good enough. I went to the track this morning, this is the result.

Distance without stopping 6/10 mile
Exercise time 6:30
max HR 180

My breathing was so bad by 1/2 mile thst I was weezing and afraid to continue.

I will keep trying and hope it improves. I can not believe that my running has gotten so BAD.

Steph

 

[mtkayak]

Well Steph, your resting heart rate sounds good. I would kill for that low of a heart rate Mine is in the high 50's. Normal heart rate is 60- 100 bpm so you are good there. It sounds like you are becoming symptomatic from the MR. You may want to emphasize this to the Card. That you are declining in your activities. It sounds like you are doing all the proper testing though. I became very winded when I run and still do, as a result of my Tricuspid and abnormal Venticle doesn't work effieciently so I simply don't get enough blood to the lungs, i.e. oxygenated blood to all the tissue and I become weak but I recover fast sometimes. My situation is different from yours but in the end, it can have the same result. Your probably not getting enough oxygenated blood to the body while exercising, in effect, becoming exercise intolerant. I know how it feels when you are a very active person and all of a sudden you are limited to what you can do.

 

[Jas0n]

i also have (had??, i just had avr 2 months ago) a very high heart rate. im a 22 year old cyclist with a max heart rate of 220ish; during rides, i would frequently ride at 180bpm and often, when pushing myself (or being pushed by others), ride into the 200 range. i once observed 220 bpm while training with another pro mountain biker. that is, right before i threw up! my resting rate, even while i was racing, was never better than 65bpm though.

anyway, the one thing that my cardio noticed - before i had my avr - is that my blood pressure would drop right around 175bpm. i managed to finish the stress test, but only with a heart rate of 202bpm. interstingly, i was not told that such heart rates were dangerous to my heart. instead, the drop in blood pressure COULD lead to me passing out, which is very dangerous while riding at 25mph! i am very interested to see whether or not my heart will still be able to achieve such speeds. i have only come back to exercise in the last three weeks, so i havent pushed myself to such levels just yet.

one thing i noticed is that my heart rate would jump early in a ride (presumably after i warmed up), after which time it would settle back down. i noticed it was better for me to put in a few sprints or hard efforts early on, then allow myself to recover, than it was to try and stay below a certain threshold for a whole ride.

 

[MikeHeim]

What tricks can you suggest to keep my heart rate lower?

I can take a stab at this one. My trick for keeping my heart rate lower is taking beta-blockers. Not much of a trick, really. I'm surprised your Cardio hasn't brought this up yet. I take 50mg of Atenolol twice per day, and I can't manage to get my HR above 140 with even the most strenuous exercise. It's kinda like having a governor on your engine, so I hate it. I'm actually going to try to get my Cardio to drop my dose somewhat at my next visit. However, if a lower HR is what you desire, I can't argue with the effectiveness.

 

[tprice54]

Running heart rate

Running heart rate

Let me take a stab also...it sort of sounds like your track workout shows you were sprinting more than running. A sprinter would get a heart rate, etc. higher in a shorter period of time. I know you didn't think you were, so maybe that is what the dr. is looking for. Is it your valve or is it you need to find your running pace that allows you to run longer and a lower heart rate?

Tom Price
Certified Running Coach

 

[inlaguna]

Steph,

I got to the point before surgery that I could only do about 4.5 MPH while running/walking on a treadmill before feeling faint. I could, however still do the bike and the eliptical machine at a farily good clip. I considered myself in decent shape at the time, but the running just didn't work with my stenotic valve.

Post Op I am full -out running between 7:30 and 9:30 minute miles with no symptoms. Running still is the fastest way to raise my heartrate. I get to about 160-170 bpm. My resting rate is about 50. I have taken varying doses of beta blockers for over 10 years now and remain on a very small dosage at this point. So with a more efficient valve I noticed a change almost immediately.

I think a TEE or Echo is important to tell you that you are not experiencing any thickening of the ventricle and to determine gradients. It should put you more at ease as well. I exercised up to a week before my surgery and I know it helped me recover more quickly.

Good luck with everything. I'm 43 by the way so right about the same age.


Dan

 

[Steph]

Thank you all so much for your replies. Having you to bounce this off of really helps!!
Mikeheim:
My cardio and I have talked about the beta blocker some. Two years ago I promised him that I would not let my HR get too high etc... If we could hold off of the meds. He has agreed and knows how I feel about taking anything. We spoke about it again at our last meeting; he will not recommend any meds until all of my tests are complete. For that I am grateful. Sometimes I think doctors are too quick to medicate. I am sure that my high heart rate is MUCH more of a concern to me than to him.

JasOn:
I am so glad that you are back on the bike again, and feeling well!!! Keep up the good work. You sound like my brother. He was involved in a bike race up Mount Washington and was pushing 200-205bpm. Oh to be young again!!!

Tom Price:
Well I have to admit I never would have thought I was going too fast. I felt like I was just jogging along. However I heard what you said and I tried it again today. I started out very slow and kept it that way. I ended up doing 2 miles. It took me 25 minutes to get that far (a12 ½ minute mile) . The bottom line was that my breathing was fine and my heart did well. It stayed around 158bpm. I could have gone along for another hour but my knees and hips were reminding me (loudly) just why I have spent so much time on my bike instead of running down the road.

Dan:
So glad you are doing so well. Your run times are fantastic, I could never go that fast. And you are right the TEE and Echo?s are very important and will go a long way to making me feel more at ease.

Thanks again for all of your help.
Steph

 

[LLJ]

Steph: What you'll get here on VR.com is lots of good advice from well versed individuals. It looks like you've has a lot of input so I'll give you mine. I've tried to research this as a physical therapist and athlete,but I still know alot less than some people trained just on aerobic output/exercise. The first obvious thing is we are all different. Spinning instruction tends to lend itself to anerobic intervals unless you are doing an endurance class. Please forgive me, you probably know all this already. Running,being full weightbearing, will jack up your heart rate faster than partial weightbearing on a bike. If you are looking for a lower training heartrate you have to train at a lower heart rate. At you age and fitness level, 170 is not an out of the questions RACE HEARTRATE. It is not where you should be in training. I think it was Mike who said elevating HR is probably now more a function of your regurg than anything else. Remember fitness produces more power output at a lower heartrate. My favorite stat was Lance pedaling through the Pyrnees at 180 BPM. (Yes he is a freak, but you get my point) I like your doc's idea of stripping down your workout and starting again from scratch.
I don't know if any of this helps. I guess what I'm saying is going slow is no crime if it makes your heart healthier over the long run. Now if anyone can just tell me how I can get fast.........

Laura

 

[msiwik]

Welcome Steph

Welcome Steph

Thanks Mike for your reply! I do limit my caffine to one cup of coffee a day. It has been a long time since I checked my resting HR so I will do that tonight. It was around 48. My appt yesterday was a follow up from a stress test in August. My MR was worse after exercise, he stopped the test when I reached 166 (hr) and felt that that was good enough. I went to the track this morning, this is the result.

Distance without stopping 6/10 mile
Exercise time 6:30
max HR 180

My breathing was so bad by 1/2 mile thst I was weezing and afraid to continue.

I will keep trying and hope it improves. I can not believe that my running has gotten so BAD.

Steph

Steph - welcome. I don't have any wisdom advice beyond what my compadres have passed along but wanted to welcome you. Stay involved! Mark

 

[tommy]

Steph, I'm glad to hear that your heart rate settled down with slower pace. Generally, your longer runs should be 2-3 minutes per mile slower than short runs. But 158 bpm (90%) is still too high for that level of activity.

At 12 min pace my HR is about 120 bpm and I feel like I could run forever. At 9 min pace my HR is over 150 bpm and I can hold that for over a mile, but not much more. Heat plays a large role in raising my HR. 80 F adds about 15 bpm to my HR. 55F is heavenly for me.

Have your checked your recover rate? A slow drop is indication of low fitness pushing too hard. After a run, check your HR and then again 3 minutes later.

don't know if I've helped at all. Keep us posted.

 

[Steph]

Thanks for all of your kind input guys. I think I am just going to have to wait this one out and see what the tests come up with. On one side of the coin we could find out that the valve is really starting to give me trouble. On the other side it could just be that dreaded aging thing. I would never want to admit that I am getting older, or that I am not in the kind of shape I was when I was 20. Anyway thanks again, your great!

Steph