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The extremes gun toting right figures they will just win by violence and guns.
my observation from over this side of the Pacific is that they scatter like little squealing piglets when they face more than unarmed civilians ... much like the "heros" of our Eureka Stockade.

To quote from Akria Kurosawa's Seven Samurai: "War is conducted running, when you can no longer run its your turn to die".

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I don't expect this guy can run many miles before he drops dead from a heart attack.
 
Don’t know about that. Combing through this thread, there’s quite a bit of wishing death on folks that are opposed to vaccination. There was also a lot of burning, looting, and rioting in cities across the US by left leaning “peaceful protestors” that far exceeded anything that went on at the Capitol in January, yet somehow that behavior was all glossed over and excused.

Believe me, I’m not saying one side is okay and the other isn’t. I’m just saying if things escalate, there will likely be plenty of blame to go around.

Neither the far left nor the far right have a monopoly on bad behavior and it’s those of us left or right of the middle just trying to do right by ourselves, our families, and our communities that will be stuck with the fallout and the clean up bill.
 
Wow pretty nasty I would say. I don't wish anyone dead, but support their decision to do stupid things that risk only their own lives.

And btw, that is the attitude of many extreme conservatives, dems may not like your views, but we typically don't wish death on others. The right wing wants to purge the earth or anyone that does not align with their views. The problem with the dems is we need to fight on the GOP level, we think reason and compassion will fix this, we need to get in the mud with the extreme right and fight on their turf. The extremes gun toting right figures they will just win by violence and guns.
There has always been and probably always be this desire amongst certain people. Currently it seems to occupy the fascist leaning right wing at least in the United States. I'm curious as to what they're so whipped up about to want a murder people? I mean I can understand being annoyed with the ultra left and their obsession with whether you said the right word or use the right gender term etc but I don't understand why that would upset you to the point of wanting to shoot your fellow citizens? Unless they view it as a attack on their culture or something but I don't think it will be forced on them. I'm not one to cry racism and being 52 I do understand growing up in a country that is mostly European American and seeing it change can be uncomfortable, we all have our tribes, that doesn't mean I hate others though. But the common thread I see amongst ardent Trump supporters, not the cynical ones who knew he's a buffoon but like the tax cuts for the rich, bit the hardcore is that they think that Trump is their last chance to keep the brown hordes our and the only saviour of western culture. They actually believe he cares about them and is their only hope. It's sad. They actually believe all that nonsense he says like the election was stolen, he's the smartest etc ....most are losers looking to blame someone for their situation. During the 2016 election then Trump was sure he would lose he said it was rigged, of course when he won he said it was fine, but he repeatedly gave speeches where he said the "2nd amendment people" could possibly fix Hillary's rigged presidency. This is where I've lost my Republican friends who say they don't particularly like him as a person but they like what he did better. I would like to think they would draw the line at a sitting president trying to overthrow an election and encouraging his mob to attack Congress, or a candidate floating the idea of his opponent getting assassinated.
 
Don’t know about that. Combing through this thread, there’s quite a bit of wishing death on folks that are opposed to vaccination. There was also a lot of burning, looting, and rioting in cities across the US by left leaning “peaceful protestors” that far exceeded anything that went on at the Capitol in January, yet somehow that behavior was all glossed over and excused.

Believe me, I’m not saying one side is okay and the other isn’t. I’m just saying if things escalate, there will likely be plenty of blame to go around.

Neither the far left nor the far right have a monopoly on bad behavior and it’s those of us left or right of the middle just trying to do right by ourselves, our families, and our communities that will be stuck with the fallout and the clean up bill.

As I mentioned, if you want to risk your life doing stupid things as long as “you do not risk someone else’s” I am fine, go kill yourself. When you are negligent and put the rest of us at risk then yup, I throw compassion out the window, hope they get it and die before they can spread it to the folks doing there best for the greater collective.

I do agree there are bad folks on both sides, I do think the far right might be a bit more violent than the far right. I did not support BLM protests that turned into looting, peaceful protest is a right, but violence and damaging property is unacceptable regardless of the cause.
 
Don’t know about that. Combing through this thread, there’s quite a bit of wishing death on folks that are opposed to vaccination. There was also a lot of burning, looting, and rioting in cities across the US by left leaning “peaceful protestors” that far exceeded anything that went on at the Capitol in January, yet somehow that behavior was all glossed over and excused.

Believe me, I’m not saying one side is okay and the other isn’t. I’m just saying if things escalate, there will likely be plenty of blame to go around.

Neither the far left nor the far right have a monopoly on bad behavior and it’s those of us left or right of the middle just trying to do right by ourselves, our families, and our communities that will be stuck with the fallout and the clean up bill.
I don't approve of looting on any side. There's a difference though when there's a protest in a city of millions of people which always has some bad actors, and some come out and take advantage of it. You can have a protest against processed cheese and if there were enough people in the right area at night there would be looting. There's a difference between that and violence on behalf of a political leader or movement. This is a false comparison. I don't recall any of those protesters carrying Joe Biden signs or committing violence on the behalf of Joe Biden. I also recall him saying that rioting and looting isn't protesting. There are repeated videos of him saying this but I guess it serves a political purpose to attribute those riots to him and equate them to Trump's mob attacking the very foundation of our government. Also a small percentage of people taking a protest and turning it into a criminal situation is different than a group of people, and whether you want to admit it or not there is a large percentage of them on the right, who want to violently overthrow the government. Like that dummy out here earlier saying he wants a civil war and he wants the shooting to start. I would also argue that not many people out here are saying they want others to die because they're unvaccinated but even if people think that there's a difference between people wanting their stupidity and selfishness to come back to them and wanting to actually go out and shoot people because they disagree with you politically. Hell how many months after the election I can walk my dog around the block and the one cracker has a Trump sign up that says "Trump 2024 the rules have changed". What does that mean? I don't see any Biden signs like that. I hate to break us to you because you seem pretty moderate and sane but the leader of your party is willing to burn the whole thing down to serve his own purpose and so many in the party are afraid to confront him for one reason and one reason only they will be primaried and they will probably lose because 75% of the party loves that idiot. Don't believe me the FBI says that the major threat domestically is right-wing violence and white supremacists not protests. By the way I don't know if you've noticed but I don't see those riots in the street now. If they were happening under Biden and then Trump came in and they'd stopped he would be taking credit for it....
If you want to compare Congress getting invaded because they were certifying an election to some scumbag robbing a laundromat in the middle of the night enjoy....
 
Don’t know about that. Combing through this thread, there’s quite a bit of wishing death on folks that are opposed to vaccination. There was also a lot of burning, looting, and rioting in cities across the US by left leaning “peaceful protestors” that far exceeded anything that went on at the Capitol in January, yet somehow that behavior was all glossed over and excused.

Believe me, I’m not saying one side is okay and the other isn’t. I’m just saying if things escalate, there will likely be plenty of blame to go around.

Neither the far left nor the far right have a monopoly on bad behavior and it’s those of us left or right of the middle just trying to do right by ourselves, our families, and our communities that will be stuck with the fallout and the clean up bill.
Again you seem reasonable but you're falling prey to a false equivalency. I hated seeing the rioting and looting but there's a difference between that and the president's followers chanting how they wanted to hang the vice president for doing his constitutional duty while invading Congress. Do you have any question what that mob of scumbags would have done if they got a hold of some of their "enemies"?
 
pardon me, but I was just thinking more on this

Don’t know about that. Combing through this thread, there’s quite a bit of wishing death on folks that are opposed to vaccination. There was also a lot of burning, looting, and rioting in cities across the US by left leaning “peaceful protestors” that far exceeded anything that went on at the Capitol in January, yet somehow that behavior was all glossed over and excused.

perhaps, but when I read statements like:

"You (left wing liberals) hate my guts and wish I were dead. We (conservatives) hate your guts and wish you were dead. So why don't we just get this civil war underway and settle this once and for all. At this point I'm all in winner take all."​

it seems to be quite a different level to just wishing people die ... seems a lot more like open calls for violence to me.

Now to my reading of this thread (and IIRC anything I've said) the concepts of death have been restricted to more or less "if you don't want to vaccinate then its ok by me if you die"

OR

(on the IMO unreasonable and irrational side) "if you vaccinate you'll be killed by that"

There seems to be a complete absence of rationality on the part of those who are against vaccination and yet those who are for it (such as me) a view that its a prevention of further harm and at the very least a prevention of the hospital system being over run.

If there is a good argument to counter what I've written please furnish it. However the evidence for vaccination is compelling.

I do see points in the argument presented here:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/07/unvaccinated-different-anti-vax/619523/
and I do see the view that its not killing enough people so why worry. This does sidestep (or outright ignore) members of the community who don't die but suffer long duration of symptoms. This must have economic costs (and it does).

Believe me, I’m not saying one side is okay and the other isn’t. I’m just saying if things escalate, there will likely be plenty of blame to go around.

Well to my mind if you make arguments supporting avoiding vaccination it will be siezed upon as one more validation by those who are against vaccination.



Neither the far left nor the far right have a monopoly on bad behavior and it’s those of us left or right of the middle just trying to do right by ourselves, our families, and our communities that will be stuck with the fallout and the clean up bill.

and part of that cleanup bill will be the economic effects of protracted lockdowns and people suffering needlessly (which includes health workers) the economic effects of downturn.

Please (even briefly) explain how you think vaccination of the majority will be harmful?

https://abcnews.go.com/US/vast-majority-icu-patients-covid-19-unvaccinated-abc/story?id=79128401
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/24/cdc...ore-likely-to-be-hospitalized-with-covid.html
seems harder and harder to rationally argue the case against vaccination, but I'm willing to listen to your arguments.
 
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You say "poorly educated." I call it "unindoctrinated". Bottom line is this. You (left wing liberals) hate my guts and wish I were dead. We (conservatives) hate your guts and wish you were dead. So why don't we just get this civil war underway and settle this once and for all. At this point I'm all in winner take all.

Congratulations. Your post may very well be the most mentally unstable post in the history of the forum
 
........snip....

View attachment 888089

I don't expect this guy can run many miles before he drops dead from a heart attack.

At least he's "wearing" a mask.

When they were required where I work (they no longer are now post-vaccines btw although you are supposed to put one on if less than 6 feet from someone yet hardly anyone does) multiple people wore them exactly like the guy above as chinguards or even hats. In one department in fact where they were allowed to get away with it every single day against company policy more than half of those people all got sick with covid. Still they did not mask up even when most of them were sick. On the bright side they didn't carry semi-automatic weapons around the workplace.
 
Never underestimate the naivety, stupidity and gullibility of hordes of American voters, mostly uneducated, unsophisticated. Someone once said, if fascism ever comes to America or another democracy, it will be thrust with patriotism. Well, at least Trump has a funny sense of humor.
 
Never underestimate the naivety, stupidity and gullibility of hordes of American voters, mostly uneducated, unsophisticated. Someone once said, if fascism ever comes to America or another democracy, it will be thrust with patriotism. Well, at least Trump has a funny sense of humor.
Well I don't think that's uniquely American. I mean I think when fascism comes to any country it's sold as patriotism. Maybe Trump's buffoonery is an American thing but I sort of recall Mussolini was right in there with him.
 
...Its probably hard for Tom (who is such just a strong man in Jesus) to understand that others are not and may suffer from the poison...

Pellicle, please don't put words in my mouth. Who knows what you mean by a "strong man in Jesus? I don't really care to know. I have respect for all people's beliefs, from wiccan to Christian to Buddhist, to animist, and even for your beliefs as a lapsed Catholic (I think that's what you said.) My argument in this thread is that people who are not vaccinated are as rational and as irrational as those that are vaccinated. People are people, even a Nobel prize winner can believe in a debunked wonder-cure.

A little debunking on the current covid science is in order. For those of you who believe that the covid response is science driven, the fact that there are not new social distancing rules due to the delta variant is proof that its not science but politics. The covid rate in many communities is soaring to 2020 levels, many non-US communities are back in lockdown, but many communities are not. In those that are not it is due to politicians caring more about the economy than protection from covid or ensuring medical services can function. Biden and Faucci don't have the guts to call for a lockdown or social distancing that effects tourism, restaurants, line workers, healthcare...

The WHO calls the booster shot unneeded and irresponsible. This is a global pandemic, that third shot going to wealthy US and Israeli citizens is best going into the arm of someone in Lebanon, Egypt, Australia, Japan, etc. The next delta variant can come from anywhere, Missouri to Japan. In a global pandemic the third shot is politics not science. To manage this virus, we need to "treat" humankind, not just Israelis and Americans.
 
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Pellicle, please don't put words in my mouth. Who knows what you mean by a "strong man in Jesus? I don't really care to know. I have respect for all people's beliefs, from wiccan to Christian to Buddhist, to animist, and even for your beliefs as a lapsed Catholic (I think that's what you said.) My argument in this thread is that people who are not vaccinated are as rational and as irrational as those that are vaccinated. People are people, even a Nobel prize winner can believe in a debunked wonder-cure.

A little debunking on the current covid science is in order. For those of you who believe that the covid response is science driven, the fact that there are not new social distancing rules due to the delta variant is proof that its not science but politics. The covid rate in many communities is soaring to 2020 levels, many non-US communities are back in lockdown, but many communities are not. In those that are not it is due to politicians caring more about the economy than protection from covid or ensuring medical services can function. Biden and Faucci don't have the guts to call for a lockdown or social distancing that effects tourism, restaurants, line workers, healthcare...

The WHO calls the booster shot unneeded and irresponsible. This is a global pandemic, that third shot going to wealthy US and Israeli citizens is best going into the arm of someone in Lebanon, Egypt, Australia, Japan, etc. The next delta variant can come from anywhere, Missouri to Japan. In a global pandemic the third shot is politics not science. To manage this virus, we need to "treat" humankind, not just Israelis and Americans.
I'd beg to differ on the rationality part. Had a conversation today with a nice lady in an office where I collect a water sample It was telling me that her husband's work is now requiring vaccination. I could tell this wasn't welcome news and she went on to talk about a doctor who said covid hospitalizations are as high this year as this time last year when the vaccines weren't available yet. Taking this as her producing "evidence" of their ineffectiveness I explained to her that if you look at the states that are having high hospitalizations they are also the states with low vaccination. Like down in Mississippi and Alabama it's approximately 30% of adults who are fully vaccinated. In New Jersey it's around 70%, my wife works at a hospital in New Jersey and it is not remotely as bad as last year. I also went on to explain to her that this is a different virus than what we were dealing with last year, it is far more contagious and it is also deadlier. I also explained that in a state like New Jersey where 70% of adults are vaccinated and 30% aren't, if the vaccines weren't effective about 70% of the people right now in an ICU with covid would be vaccinated people and about 30% would be unvaccinated. However it's closer to 99% of those in hospital right now are unvaccinated. So The fact that more people are in the hospital than the same time last year in the United States, if that's true, is actually proof of how well the vaccines work. Last year we were all unvaccinated But this year a lot of us are. I would imagine that the percentage of people this year that are unvaccinated and infected is much higher than it was last year even though more closer to herd immunity. When you look at states, I would say generally more educated modern states, in the United States you will see that hospitalization rates are much higher in states with low vaccination so I don't understand how not getting vaccinated could be considered just as rational, let alone moral.
As for the vaccinating the world, yes we need to do that but the reality is no country is going to give up its access to the vaccine in order to help others. At the end of the day the vaccine in an arm is a vaccine in an arm. I think you're being a little too cute by saying that it is greedy pretty United States to want a third shot in people's arms when large parts of the world have zero when it reality you don't really think most Americans shouldn't get it either. It's just a way to try to have a moral argument against it. In other words it's like basically lying
 
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